Clamp Meters

[Pidsley]

these were the ones we were talking about the other day . . . . Van alarm going off at 6am




I've got this one . . .

https://amzn.to/3nd43b4

and this one . . .

UNI-T UT204A Digital Handheld Clamp Multimeter Tester DMM Voltmeter AC DC Meter: Amazon.co.uk: Car & Motorbike

***********

To use it . . .

zero the tool with the Z clear button.

clamp around the main battery NEG cable,

take a reading. (DC Amps scale)

lock the van and keep an eye on the reading.

the modules will go to sleep after around 10-20mins.

after the modules are asleep the VW spec is a draw of below 50mA. (0.05A)

keep taking periodic measurements and write them down. (say every 1min)

if the tool goes to sleep and switches off, just remove/Zero/Replace and continue.




remember to flick the bonnet catch so the van sees the bonnet closed. (so th van sees it closed and will then fully shut down the modules)


***********



Edit: . . . . .

What do the numbers mean? :

well if you have greater than 50mA when at rest/sleeping then you are draining the battery with something other than just the Vans OEM electrics, causing the battery to drop faster than expected. ( reading after the 10-20min sleep/shut down)

Prime candidates are:

DashCams, (30mA-1A)
GPS devices (30mA-1A)
Speed Trap detectrors (30mA-1A)
OBDII plugs (like Carista etc) (30mA-1A)
USB chargers (30mA-3A)
LED lights (30mA-3A)
DC-DC charger (0mA-xxA)
MPPT solar (0mA-xxA)
anything else connected to the starter battery


what do i do now? :

start looking over the van to find NON-OEM kit and start unplugging it or removing fuses to locate the power draw.

when you unplug it you will see the DC Amps (mA) start dropping.

you then need to decide whether to relocate the power source to the leisure battery, or other.


The same applies for the Leisure battery and locating power drains . . . for example a dash cam can run a leisure battery flat after a few days !!

.

.

Thank you for the advice. I have now purchased and used the clamp meter. Results are:
. van locked, all sleep, dash cam unplugged, tracker working; varied between 0.45 and 0.60 amps.
. as above with cam switched on and in sleep mode. 0.760 amps.

My VW main dealer emailed to say.."The AMP draw should be around 0.03 of an amp draw and no more than 0.07 amp draw"
The tracker company confirmed: "Deep sleep (90 seconds after the ignition goes off ) 20 Milliamps" (0.02amps).

Its a brand new battery. So Am I right in thinking that there is a drain of between 0.36 and 0.51amps?

Where are the fuses to start unplugging first do you think? The base van side or the leisure side?

 

[Grim Reaper]

My first step would be to do a voltage drop test across all the permanent fuses, normally down the middle of the fusebox, have a look on YouTube at Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics at some of Ivan's videos to see how it's done. A FLIR camera might also help to see which fuse is warmer from the half amp current draw.
The only awkward thing is the fuses under the battery make it difficult to test them in situ.

 

[Loz]

If you want to do it thoroughly, watch this.

 

[Pidsley]

Great advice and great video. I missed the latching the hood/bonnet trip. Once I did that the results changed to:
.
. van locked, all sleep, dash cam unplugged, tracker working; varied between 0.166 and 0.210 amps.
. as above with cam switched on and in sleep mode. it rose to 0.600. amps.

Interestingly with van locked and asleep reading 0.188amps I tried to open the locked side sliding door. The amps draw raised to 1.055amps. Same with the rear door handle. But no change when trying the handles on the front doors.

Conclusion, get my dashcam rewired to my leisure battery. The leisure side is generally plugged into 240v, when on the drive.

Thank you all so much for helping through what's been an absolute pain.

 

[Dellmassive]

ah yes,

The Humble Mechanic
Ivan at PHAD
Diagnose Dan
and VAG Technic

some of the best YT diagnostic and mechanic dudes you can watch.

 

[Pidsley]

these were the ones we were talking about the other day . . . . Van alarm going off at 6am




I've got this one . . .

https://amzn.to/3nd43b4

and this one . . .

UNI-T UT204A Digital Handheld Clamp Multimeter Tester DMM Voltmeter AC DC Meter: Amazon.co.uk: Car & Motorbike

***********

To use it . . .

zero the tool with the Z clear button.

clamp around the main battery NEG cable,

take a reading. (DC Amps scale)

lock the van and keep an eye on the reading.

the modules will go to sleep after around 10-20mins.

after the modules are asleep the VW spec is a draw of below 50mA. (0.05A)

keep taking periodic measurements and write them down. (say every 1min)

if the tool goes to sleep and switches off, just remove/Zero/Replace and continue.




remember to flick the bonnet catch so the van sees the bonnet closed. (so th van sees it closed and will then fully shut down the modules)


***********



Edit: . . . . .

What do the numbers mean? :

well if you have greater than 50mA when at rest/sleeping then you are draining the battery with something other than just the Vans OEM electrics, causing the battery to drop faster than expected. ( reading after the 10-20min sleep/shut down)

Prime candidates are:

DashCams, (30mA-1A)
GPS devices (30mA-1A)
Speed Trap detectrors (30mA-1A)
OBDII plugs (like Carista etc) (30mA-1A)
USB chargers (30mA-3A)
LED lights (30mA-3A)
DC-DC charger (0mA-xxA)
MPPT solar (0mA-xxA)
anything else connected to the starter battery


what do i do now? :

start looking over the van to find NON-OEM kit and start unplugging it or removing fuses to locate the power draw.

when you unplug it you will see the DC Amps (mA) start dropping.

you then need to decide whether to relocate the power source to the leisure battery, or other.


The same applies for the Leisure battery and locating power drains . . . for example a dash cam can run a leisure battery flat after a few days !!

.

.

I'm going round in circles and wondering whether I'm being over ambitious. After multiple testing I have a reading of 0.166amp draw on the starter battery (45mins after ignition off and everything locked (including bonnet catch). The only NON-OEM that I'm aware of fitted is the tracker which is supposed to draw 20milliamps in deep sleep mode (90 secs after ignition off).

So, 0.166amp less 0.02amp (tracker), less VW module draw of 0.05amp gives an unexplained draw of 0.116amps. Should I be concerned or is this within tolerance? Is the clamp i used in the photo accurate, have I set it up correctly ( I did zero it after selecting DC).

Starter battery is depleting by about 0.1v/day.

 

[t0mb0]

I'm going round in circles and wondering whether I'm being over ambitious. After multiple testing I have a reading of 0.166amp draw on the starter battery (45mins after ignition off and everything locked (including bonnet catch). The only NON-OEM that I'm aware of fitted is the tracker which is supposed to draw 20milliamps in deep sleep mode (90 secs after ignition off).

So, 0.166amp less 0.02amp (tracker), less VW module draw of 0.05amp gives an unexplained draw of 0.116amps. Should I be concerned or is this within tolerance? Is the clamp i used in the photo accurate, have I set it up correctly ( I did zero it after selecting DC).

Starter battery is depleting by about 0.1v/day.

View attachment 187371

If that 0.166A is constant, then it equates to losing about 4Ah (i.e. about 5% of battery capacity depending on starter size) per day which feels way too high to me. Given the tracker is the only non-OEM thing in there, I would start by trying to get your clamp meter on that to see whether it really is drawing only 20mA or whether it's over that.

 

[Loz]

Check there is nothing left plugged into your ODB port..

 

[Pidsley]

If that 0.166A is constant, then it equates to losing about 4Ah (i.e. about 5% of battery capacity depending on starter size) per day which feels way too high to me. Given the tracker is the only non-OEM thing in there, I would start by trying to get your clamp meter on that to see whether it really is drawing only 20mA or whether it's over that.

Thank you. If only I knew where the tracker is secretly installed. I'll have a hunt at the weekend.

 

[Dellmassive]

i normally quote 50mA as the level we need to be below.

that because at above 50mA you will be a fault code triggered for :

"Battery Regulator 02256 – quiescent current - Battery monitor detecting power drain from starter battery (about above 50mA) (left the Carista plugged in obd2 PORT overnight)"


..


so the 30mA quote is good to know.



....


as for your 0.166A ( 166mA) draw, that would imply the 30mA PLUS any additional kit your running, to make up the the total.

this is looking like normal tracker or USB charger draw to me.


a 20mA tracker draw is ridiculously low, most trackers have an internal battery for this reason. . . . trackers draw more that that, especially when transmitting. . .


ill see if i can get some data from my van in regards to sleeping power draw,

i have WIFI + tracker + USB all running 24/7, with half connected to the Leisure battery and some to the starter battery. . .


.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

can anyone else with a clamp meter help out by adding some date here?


add, current draws:

IGN ON - engine OFF,
IGN OFF - van unlocked.
IGN OFF - VAN locked. (after 30sec)
IGN OFF - VAN locked (after 15mins)(sleeping)


Add pics is you can.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

 

[mmi]

IGN OFF - van unlocked.

0.2A - detailed below

Trouble turning over

Hi all I have had an ongoing issue with my van struggling to turn over, this all started towards the end of last year when I went on holiday for 2 weeks. When I returned I started the van and although it started it struggled turning over, I didn't think a lot of it as the van had been stood...

www.t6forum.com

IGN OFF - VAN locked. (after 30sec)

If I remember correctly this moment is a bit vague as the BCM is just about to shut down. Instead I would use e.g. 2-3 minutes to get more "stable" results (effectively the same as below).

IGN OFF - VAN locked (after 15mins)(sleeping

35mA

 

[Pidsley]

Thanks all, just to confirm my 166mA draw is with the van asleep for 40 minutes, all locked, bonnet latch closed. Dash cam disconnected. Tracker still active although it should be in sleep mode, but even if awake should only draw 70mA max. Please see text below from the Installer.

 

[Pidsley]

Check there is nothing left plugged into your ODB port..

No. just checked.

 

[Dellmassive]

Heres mine from just now.

add, current draws:

IGN ON - engine OFF, ------- 8.33A
IGN OFF - van unlocked. ----- 0.06A
IGN OFF - VAN locked. (after 30sec) ------- 0.007A
IGN OFF - VAN locked (after 15mins)(sleeping) ------- 0.029A


Add pics is you can.


++++++++++++++++

over view,





IGN ON - engine OFF, - 5.33-8.33A (lights and fans off)




.
IGN OFF - van unlocked
bonet catch closed.


IGN OFF - van locked 0.06A 60mA


..


IGN OFF - VAN locked. (after 30sec) - 0.007A 7ma




.

IGN OFF - VAN locked (after 15mins)(sleeping) 0.022a (22mA)






0.029A (29mA)


.

 

[Dellmassive]

This is my BM2 plot for,

today, 7 days 15 days. . . . .

GREEN trace is the starter battery.


PURPLE trace is the Leisure battery.

today:




7 days:




15days:









more info here: Battery Monitoring -- How I Done It --




.

 

[Alster]

@Dellmassive seems odd that it pulls more current when it’s sleeping?

 

[Dellmassive]

most of my kit that runs 24/7 is now powered from the Leisure battery . . .

ie

wifi, tracker, USB, dashcam etc. . .


as you can see im drawing 0.46A (460mA) while the van is sleeping. . .

thats the tracker sleeping,
the wifi dongle broadcasting a wifi signal,
and the USB chargers just being switched on - but not charging anything.
dashcam is IGN fed so not accounted for here.




you can see from these plots that its a constant draw from the battery . . .








.
.

 

[Dellmassive]

@Dellmassive seems odd that it pulls more current when it’s sleeping?

thats just a blip in the data . . . . . mine seems happy around 29mA when sleeping.

so around the 30mA VW quoted.

but thats with all my 3rd party kit now running off the leisure battery.

any static draw above 50mA will generate a fault code.

 

[Pidsley]

i normally quote 50mA as the level we need to be below.

that because at above 50mA you will be a fault code triggered for :

"Battery Regulator 02256 – quiescent current - Battery monitor detecting power drain from starter battery (about above 50mA) (left the Carista plugged in obd2 PORT overnight)"


..


so the 30mA quote is good to know.



....


as for your 0.166A ( 166mA) draw, that would imply the 30mA PLUS any additional kit your running, to make up the the total.

this is looking like normal tracker or USB charger draw to me.


a 20mA tracker draw is ridiculously low, most trackers have an internal battery for this reason. . . . trackers draw more that that, especially when transmitting. . .


ill see if i can get some data from my van in regards to sleeping power draw,

i have WIFI + tracker + USB all running 24/7, with half connected to the Leisure battery and some to the starter battery. . .


.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

can anyone else with a clamp meter help out by adding some date here?


add, current draws:

IGN ON - engine OFF,
IGN OFF - van unlocked.
IGN OFF - VAN locked. (after 30sec)
IGN OFF - VAN locked (after 15mins)(sleeping)


Add pics is you can.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

All checked again. No USB charging, no wifi, no dash cam, nothing on ODR port. Left to sleep for 60 mins, this morning, draw is still reading 0.166A

thats just a blip in the data . . . . . mine seems happy around 29mA when sleeping.

so around the 30mA VW quoted.

but thats with all my 3rd party kit now running off the leisure battery.

any static draw above 50mA will generate a fault code.

Excellent data. Will the fault code generated above 50mA draw give details of where the draw comes from ?

 

[Dellmassive]

Will the fault code generated above 50mA draw give details of where the draw comes from

No, have you got a code reader scanner?

Carista,
OBD11,
VCDS,
other?

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