Retrofit: Power fold mirror with fold on remote lock

[n10n]

So, pop the mirror glass off and try to figure out if the mirror glass is loose against adjuster (small round thing), adjuster loose against the frame (large plastic behind the adjuster) or if the frame itself is loose.

If you haven’t removed the glass before there is one more large plastic part in the front that covers the frame but it just has the visible black edges around the mirror glass and it positions the covers.

 

[mlh677]

@n10n - thanks for a great response, I appreciate the details and it is reassuring to know that the Aliexpress motors could be a good fallback option if all else fails!

Loose mirror glass was my first thought, but this was not the issue for me. I made a high-speed video of the van doors being closed and when played back at normal speed (slow motion) it can clearly be seen that the base is firmly fixed to the door whereas the mirror body itself bounces around - so when I have the opportunity I will strip down the mirrors fully and play around with the motor mountings. This could be fun due to the non-OEM build, though hopefully it will be a simple fix.

If I get frustrated then it's good to know that fitting motors to my OEM Heated mirrors is another available option to resolve the problem.

 

[n10n]

@n10n - thanks for a great response, I appreciate the details and it is reassuring to know that the Aliexpress motors could be a good fallback option if all else fails!

Loose mirror glass was my first thought, but this was not the issue for me. I made a high-speed video of the van doors being closed and when played back at normal speed (slow motion) it can clearly be seen that the base is firmly fixed to the door whereas the mirror body itself bounces around - so when I have the opportunity I will strip down the mirrors fully and play around with the motor mountings. This could be fun due to the non-OEM build, though hopefully it will be a simple fix.

If I get frustrated then it's good to know that fitting motors to my OEM Heated mirrors is another available option to resolve the problem.

I'll try to pay close attention to the mirrors in the evening when I will be driving a good run, but can't say I would have noticed any vibrations / wobbling. Would hate that you changed the motors and still had the same issue, it's not exactly cheap change and quite a lot of work too. Here's my mirror in a video after the aliexpress motors had been fitted, that's on a good surface though and doing about 70mph in the vid.

(Side Assist) / (Blind Spot Detection & Rear Cross Traffic Alert) retrofit

And so it begins… :whistle: Ok realistically will still take couple of months to receive all bits and bobs and to find time to put it all together, but I’m anyway excited for some good sensor pr0n :p

www.t6forum.com

 

[n10n]

I'll try to pay close attention to the mirrors in the evening when I will be driving a good run

About 100 miles later, including some gravel and pot-holy b-roads, I can definitely say there’s no any kind of vibrations. And my mirrors still have gaps so that’s not a factor.

 

[huw169]

Hi Guys
I bought all the kit and wired up my module, then had a 'short' break while I knocked the house about a bit.
So, back on the case now.

I'm going to retest all my wiring and motors on the bench again to familiarise myself, then get that all installed before i tackle fitting the motors to my std mirrors.

Any tips on the following:-
1 - How to strip down the mirrors and install the Taiwan motor modules without breaking clips etc?
2 - Any tips on best way to get door cards off on my own without breaking clips?
3 - Tips in how to connect into the central fuse board, and which contacts to start looking at? Do i need to order piggy back fuses etc?

Any online/youtube videos you guys can link to would be most useful.
I'm hoping doing this in summer will limit clip breakage as it is always a concern for me how much force to put in.

Also, where is the best place to tap into for the on/off signal for puddle lights i'm going to put in the bottom of the door cards? I only really want the one on that particular door to come on so I'm assuming the door switch is the best option. Is there something else I should be considering?

Thank you

 

[n10n]

1 - How to strip down the mirrors and install the Taiwan motor modules without breaking clips etc?

Many have tried but not sure if anyone’s succeeded. I think the mirrors are not made for disassembly as vw likes to sell entire units. Moderate heat and wd40 are my go-to trick bag but didn’t help in this case. If you manage to open them without snapping any don’t keep it to yourself!

2 - Any tips on best way to get door cards off on my own without breaking clips?

Door cards are relatively easy, those clips don’t break that easily. Still, they’re not very expensive so worth keeping a bag of ten around - sucks if you can’t complete the job due to a broken clip.

T6.1 door card removal

I've become quite the expert on removing the door card on my T6 , but has anyone done the same to a T6.1? I'm sure they have. So what are the differences? where are the important clips etc?

www.t6forum.com

[GUIDE] How to remove the front door card on a T6

Can't have too many "how to" threads with pics, so here goes... Quick steps to remove door card (EDIT: this is the driver's side, but the passenger side is exactly the same steps, just fewer connections) 1. Prise off trim on handle on door card (little slot to below rear to put a screwdriver...

www.t6forum.com

One specific tip for refitting door cards: the window lower seal will probably come off with the door card. But it’s much easier to put back together if you take the seal away from door card and put it back to it’s place in door before offering the door card.

3 - Tips in how to connect into the central fuse board, and which contacts to start looking at? Do i need to order piggy back fuses etc?

T6.1 right? Some ignition live fuses in post T6.1 Ignition live fuse

I guess piggybacks are ok, personally I like to use the empty slots though. Quite a bit more work to get behind fuse box and terminals + crimp tool needed but much cleaner result. Having done few retrofits and few other installations it would not have been even possible to use piggybacks, they eat lot of space. As an afterthought would probably have been wise to add couple of small separate fuse boxes for non-OEM stuff.

 

[n10n]

Also, where is the best place to tap into for the on/off signal for puddle lights i'm going to put in the bottom of the door cards? I only really want the one on that particular door to come on so I'm assuming the door switch is the best option. Is there something else I should be considering?

This is for T6, not sure about T6.1, so take with a grain of salt but it's not as simple as just tapping to a wire.

The door contact is a switched negative, kind of, but there's some pulsing going on as I suppose BCM continuously measures the switches as part of alarms etc. See Problem with aftermarket puddle lights connected to door lock on 2019 T6 and earlier posts in that thread. I suppose it can be made to work but there can be weird side effects as additional circuits will change the circuit impedance - and depending on the lights you use they might work, not work, glow, behave differently when engine is running or anything in between.

IMHO cleanest would be to get such signals using some CAN box rather than interfere with vehicle circuits directly. Probably it's possible to make them work properly with tapping as well but that falls in the land of analog circuit design and implementation if that's your thing. I think it would need some kind of a high impedance buffer circuit that measures input voltage and decides output based on that, rather than using the switched ground for any load currents.

 

[huw169]

Thanks for the info @n10n. Most helpful

Mirror strip down - I think @Robert must have done it this way as I'm using the same units. Any tips Robert?

I found this,

so will have a go in a week or so and post results - good or bad...

My van is a 2019 T6, so would imaging not the same as link you gave. I'll do some more digging. It may become obvious once I access the fuse panel, but not stripped anything down yet.

As for puddle light, i might leave that for now if the door cards are that easy to remove. I have 'some' electrical ability, so i'll need to get my head around that.
Would it be possible to run a perm live to relay linked to the negative of the door switch to make the relay live, and that switches the puddle light when door is open? See, I'm a simpleton when it come to electrics! LOL All the earlier chat about the different puddle light operations kind of confused me.
Will have a poke around when door card is off but think it's a job for after the mirrors are done.

Many thanks

 

[n10n]

My van is a 2019 T6, so would imaging not the same as link you gave. I'll do some more digging. It may become obvious once I access the fuse panel, but not stripped anything down yet.

Ah ok, T6 main fuse box in the foot well has 3 main columns - middle one is ignition live and edges are permanent live

Would it be possible to run a perm live to relay linked to the negative of the door switch to make the relay live, and that switches the puddle light when door is open?

Maybe, maybe not. I would at the very least fit a stop diode in order to avoid permanent live being presented to BCM pin through the coil when the switch is open. And if using coil relay, another one over the coil in order to eat voltage spikes. But, don't quote me on that. Not tested and just speculating.

 

[huw169]

Busy day today!

Fitted the folding mirrors. They work of the switch with ignition on no problems, but don’t fold on locking. I followed Roberts circuit diagram and posted my own drawing of it.
Where to start with the diagnostics? I tapped into the purple wire in the drivers door lock loom. I can only imagine either the purple wire is incorrect,

the connector block has not worked well, or I need to switch inputs on the module for folding when locking. Any suggestions welcome.
I’ll look tomorrow. Been at it since 7am and I’m done now.

The mirrors are stripable, but what a PITA! The video I posted is not right. The glass comes out first, then the top cover needs to come off, then unscrew lower cover from front, then it’s all easy to get apart.

The motor modules fit well but the cable hole is significantly smaller and needed all the connectors removing.
This one was particularly annoying.

Broke a few clips, but no real dramas. The two tabs at the top of the rear cover are particularly fragile. And the motor modules are slightly dimensional different from OEM as there is a small gap at the swivel point - think that has been mentioned before.

But, I now have folding mirrors.

 

[n10n]

Nice!

Fitted the folding mirrors. They work of the switch with ignition on no problems, but don’t fold on locking. I followed Roberts circuit diagram and posted my own drawing of it.
Where to start with the diagnostics? I tapped into the purple wire in the drivers door lock loom. I can only imagine either the purple wire is incorrect,
the connector block has not worked well, or I need to switch inputs on the module for folding when locking. Any suggestions welcome.
I’ll look tomorrow. Been at it since 7am and I’m done now.

Purple should be correct and it should be the same on both doors - that is, there's no LHD/RHD differences and it doesn't matter from which door the purple is tapped in to.

First I would check that ACC (ignition live) to the module is really off - LOCK and UNLOCK module inputs do not work while it's on.

Next, I would just manually feed 12V to UNLOCK of the module and see if that does anything - the module remembers folding state and if the motor polarities or positions happen to be in just opposite than what the module thinks they are LOCK might not do anything. I had a similar glitch with the switch working the wrong way - I just ended swapping FOLD and UNFOLD wires from the module connector. The module connector is tons easier to unpin than any vw connector

 

[huw169]

Nice!


Purple should be correct and it should be the same on both doors - that is, there's no LHD/RHD differences and it doesn't matter from which door the purple is tapped in to.

First I would check that ACC (ignition live) to the module is really off - LOCK and UNLOCK module inputs do not work while it's on.

Next, I would just manually feed 12V to UNLOCK of the module and see if that does anything - the module remembers folding state and if the motor polarities or positions happen to be in just opposite than what the module thinks they are LOCK might not do anything. I had a similar glitch with the switch working the wrong way - I just ended swapping FOLD and UNFOLD wires from the module connector. The module connector is tons easier to unpin than any vw connector

thanks @n10n , will be my first job in the morning. Fingers crossed.

 

[huw169]

Ok, so I’m confused now.

Checked all contacts and all good.
Swapped the lock and unlock pins and it worked - once only. Mirrors folded on door locking and unfolded on ignition.
Won’t do it again though.

Been through connections and fuses. Still works on door switch fine. Still got switched ignition live.

Could it be that I’ve been using the battery a lot so door locking signal is not strong enough?

Agree that non VW connectors are way easier to unpin. Fortunately. Lol

Thanks

 

[n10n]

Ok, so I’m confused now.

Checked all contacts and all good.
Swapped the lock and unlock pins and it worked - once only. Mirrors folded on door locking and unfolded on ignition.
Won’t do it again though.

Been through connections and fuses. Still works on door switch fine. Still got switched ignition live.

Could it be that I’ve been using the battery a lot so door locking signal is not strong enough?

Agree that non VW connectors are way easier to unpin. Fortunately. Lol

Thanks

Baffling indeed. There might be differences in how the module works compared to mine as the later ones refused to work with the relay setup as well. I think yours was couple of years old? (Retrofit: Power fold mirror with fold on remote lock)

The issue is not likely to be due to battery. That said, charging it won’t hurt.

Sorry no quick fix from me - I guess bench testing would be required in order to fully understand how the module works with different pin states.

One thing you could try though is to remove folding switch pins from the module and try to get fold on lock and unfold on ignition live working first. This will tell if holding one of the switch pins high prevents the module from operating normally through lock and ignition.

 

[n10n]

When you bring a pin up in module there’s these possible outcomes:

• Mirror moves in right direction as expected (happy scenario)
• Nothing happens - module thinks mirror is aleady in correct position
• Nothing happens because module thinks it should not do that action because of ACC high or low (switch is not supposed to work ignition off and lock is not supposed to work ignition on)
• Mirror moves in wrong direction (reversed motor polarity)
• Mirror tries to move but cannot because it’s already at end of rotation in that direction
• Nothing happens because module is broken or voltage too low

By measuring and bringing pins up you need to get on top of module state and then move things around until the state matches the actual mirror positions.

And finally a silly question: you moved the ignition live jumper in the module to the ignition live position, right?

 

[huw169]

Thank you for that great info @n10n.. Much appreciated.

You’re right, it wasn’t the battery.
Kind of strange it worked once on locking, but it seems reliable off the switch.

Not a stupid question re the jumper switch. I built this over 2 years ago and I have no recollection about the jumper.
First thing to try, but not today as I have placed it here

At the bottom of centre consul, and now all the dash is back together.

(I had to get on with some chores as Mrs huw169 wanted shelves up lol)

Thank you for the great info. I will start some more diagnosis when I next get a chance.

 

[Iany1954]

Final form ready for installation and timer circuit testing with motors

View attachment 194602

I did eventually decide that the two timers were excessive (they were fed from ignition 12v via the switched relay so no excessive drain). I instead modified the module pcb with extra diode, capacitor and resistor on each channel. The lighter (pencil) components are the additions to the module input circuit.

 

[huw169]

Found the time to strip my dash out today and get access to my module to switch the jumper, and guess what, I don't have one.
I think I'm going to need to get a new module and convert over.
Any links to the ones you guys got with jumpers so mine will fold on locking?
Thanks

 

[n10n]

Found the time to strip my dash out today and get access to my module to switch the jumper, and guess what, I don't have one.
I think I'm going to need to get a new module and convert over.
Any links to the ones you guys got with jumpers so mine will fold on locking?
Thanks

Mine was this one: Smart Car Vehicle Side Mirror Auto Folding/Unfoloding System Controller Module 3184643725647 | eBay

Just to remind my module had exact opposite problem: fold on lock and unfold on ignition worked fine but had to go #212 extra miles to get OEM switch work. In practice I haven’t used manual folding at all so wouldn’t really miss the feature. It would be quite okay with a two way rocker switch somewhere out of sight but still reachable if ever needed.

If you end up switching the module I encourage you to bench test it thoroughly before installation.

 

[bobbybasic]

Where can I find the AliExpress mirror motors, anyone got a link?


I’ve been through the thread twice and can’t find anything