lithium or lead acid LB?

[Nickg60]

Seems like my 3 year old exide 142ah is on it's way out, not been charged for a few months and having been plugged in with the fridge on unbeknown to me the rcd had tripped letting the fridge kill the battery.

So replacement, another £150 exide which will do another 3 years hopefully, or do I splash out on a renogy lifepo4? I can get the 100ah smart battery for £470, plus i need a new charger for lithium so probably around £600 all in.
Is the lithium worth the extra? most trips are 2-3 days max and the 142ah exide copes fine with that so i'd probably only notice the extra theoretical 30ah once or twice a year. Are there any other benefits to lithium i'm missing?
The extra cost of the lithium pretty much would pay for a solar panel and gubbins to improve the current lead acid setup.

 

[krider]

Well, lead-acid batteries can theoretically be discharged up to 80% but, if they are discharged in this percentage every day, their useful life is very short: less than a year! To have a life of a few years, the recommended discharge percentage is 30 to 40%.

Lithium batteries, on the other hand, can be discharged up to 100%: with a recommended discharge percentage around 80%.
So you will get 80 Ah from the lipo and no more than 50 Ah from the lead acid battery.

You said that the old battery has always done pretty well...I would take a normal lead-acid battery, and, I would invest the extra money for a 200/300w foldable photovoltaic kit.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[krider]

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07K3QB8M9?ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_dp_P9P0VW813M52YBSJSH72

 

[Dellmassive]

100% go lithium IMHO.

Lithium LifePo4 12v Batteries - Time For An Upgrade?

Lithium Batteries are the future, (keep checking back for the latest news/edits) ************************************************** Dellmassive`s -- "how I Done It" -- Thread ************************************************** Kit List And Stuff -- How I Done It & What I Use --...

www.t6forum.com

.

 

[t0mb0]

Very much depends on use case but for me, if it was a choice between

a) Lithium
b) AGM + solar panel

as you imply in your post, then I’d go (b) all day long.

 

[Qnapper]

Go Lithium LifePo4 battery, the best thing I have done to the van.

 

[T6Jay]

Like you, I have managed for 2 years with a 95Ah AGM just fine, I have not noticed any fall off in performance yet. So if its a budgetary decision, I agree with @t0mb0 - get the solar. Choose a good MPPT charger.

Whichever you fit, one of these will stop you from killing it again;

BatteryProtect - Victron Energy

Disconnect the battery from non essential loads before it is completely discharged with Victron Energy's BatteryProtect. Find a dealer near you.

www.victronenergy.com

 

[Nickg60]

The old one is a deep cycle specific lb so I work on 50% - i.e. 70ah usable capacity), dell’s posts explains the pros and cons of lithium quite well but I can’t really see much of a benefit for the ££, especially as working on the 80% rule it’s only an extra 10ah.

Same again and solar it is.. solar has been the plan for a couple of years but covid has killed so much free time.

Will be lithium on retirement when van life can be full time!!

Cheers

 

[Dellmassive]

here is some info on Solar for you to mooch over:


******************************************************************

SOLAR:

• Solar Pwm & Mppt Controllers - How I Done It -
• Mobile Solar Panels ? . . . - How I Did It -
• What Solar Panel & Controller? - How We Done It -
• Solar Panel Cutting Hole In Roof !!! - How We Done It -
• 300w Plus Solar Club -- How I Done It --
• Solar Sheds & Other Non-t6 Solar Projects - How We Done It -
• [Guide] Solar Cables? . . . - How I Did It -

My Panels:

• 50w 12v socket Dash Fold panel
• 50W Bluefusion Fold panel
• 200W Lensun Fold panel
• 110w Lensun Flex panel + Mag tape
• 100w Renogy Eclipse fold panel
• 160w PhotUnis Flex rear gland panel
• 100w Renogy suitcase
• 120w Bluefusion fold panel
• 200w Lensun flex panel
• 200w Renogy suitcase panel
• 100w Renogy suitcase 2021 vsn
• 150w PU flex rear gland panel
• 160w Renogy flex rear gland panel

*****************************************************

 

[Higgidav]

So I’ve been looking at upgrading to Lithium. To save time I would like keep the swap as simple as possible so I’m veering towards the Renology batteries as the physical size is hopefully close to my existing Xtreme 110 AGM battery.

As the price difference is negligible between the 100A Smart batteries, should I go for the self heating battery RBT100LFP12SH or the version without self heating RBT100LFP12S?

I do live in the High Peak so temps can be low for several months each year and I am planning a Nordic trip in the future.

I currently have an Ablemail DCDC 121230 which I know will require reprogramming, a Victron Smart Battery Protect, and Victron Blue Smart 12/7 charger.

I appreciate the 7A charger is not ideal but hopefully it will work.

Grateful for any thoughts especially on which battery and also on my existing equipment and it’s compatibility with a lithium battery.

 

[Deaky]

So I’ve been looking at upgrading to Lithium. To save time I would like keep the swap as simple as possible so I’m veering towards the Renology batteries as the physical size is hopefully close to my existing Xtreme 110 AGM battery.

As the price difference is negligible between the 100A Smart batteries, should I go for the self heating battery RBT100LFP12SH or the version without self heating RBT100LFP12S?

I do live in the High Peak so temps can be low for several months each year and I am planning a Nordic trip in the future.

I currently have an Ablemail DCDC 121230 which I know will require reprogramming, a Victron Smart Battery Protect, and Victron Blue Smart 12/7 charger.

I appreciate the 7A charger is not ideal but hopefully it will work.

Grateful for any thoughts especially on which battery and also on my existing equipment and it’s compatibility with a lithium battery.

Either of those batteries will sit upright, under your seat. The bluetooth one won't but you can add a dongle to the others to give you the same functionality. You could sell the battery protect because the BMS in the battery has the same functionality

 

[Dellmassive]

The Renogy batterys have internal low temp protect...

That means they block incoming charge when the battery temp is below say 5 degC. (But all can be used on discharge down to -20degc)

I've got all three batteries and tested them all...

So.....

If you need to CHARGE the battery in subzero conditions then get the heated version..... It will take the first 8A of charger power to preheat the battery upto 5degc.... Then will pass full power to the battery. (The heater doesn't use its own power... Only charge power for heat.)

...

Lithium LifePo4 12v Batteries - Time For An Upgrade?

@Mike23864 & @T6ChrisO Yes thats correct. . . you can run for double the run time with Lithium vs SLA (AGM/EFB etc) this is due to you only being able to use the top 50% of the capacity of SLA batteries. with lithium you can use 100% of the capacity is you wish. ++++++++ another benefit...

www.t6forum.com

..

Lithium LifePo4 12v Batteries - Time For An Upgrade?

im desperatly waiting for some real world testing for the TN Power Lifepo4 they seem to be flooded the market in the UK for budget Lithium. cheap . . . . . but are they safe? and any good? Sorry that it took 2 years to provide feedback to @Dellmassive on this, but I thought I'd provide...

www.t6forum.com

...

Low temperature lithium battery

mid test results added to post above . . current test results. 49 hours in . . . drawing 0.8A from the battery. 88ah @ 5v battery BMS shows battery still at 100% SOC. with no draw and standby status. +++ Vic SS shows battery at 63% SOC with the 0.8A load draw. thats 41ah @ 12v...

www.t6forum.com

..


Speaking to Roamer about the low temp thing as they do testing in the Alps and stuff..... They said if you're battery is installed inside the van,then you will prob have a diesel heater to keep the ambient temp up.... (Above 5degc) so that's a concideration.

.

But I would go for the heated version, just to cover all bases.


......

Also have a look at the Poweroad low temp.

Low temperature lithium battery

Mid March 2021 was the last I see..

www.t6forum.com

..

 

[DXX]

There’s a massive difference in cost.
I’ve found my AGM batteries to be very reliable but they are connected to solar so are never seriously depleted.
Personally I would prioritise solar over lithium, obviously having both is the best option but if lead acid works it does what you need it to.

 

[Higgidav]

@Dellmassive and @Deaky many thanks for your detailed responses. I do have a heater so it’s very unlikely the van will ever get to 5degC internally when I’m using it. That said there is only £30 between the heated and non heated versions so I may as well go for the heated option.

I assume I will also need the BT2 module and then I can remove my Smart Battery Protect (thanks Deaky) and BM2 battery monitor.

Does anyone have any views on the suitability of my existing Ablemail DCDC 121230 and Blue Smart 7A charger? I am hoping both will be ok accepting they will not charge as fast as other products.

I have double checked battery sizes and the Renogy is slightly smaller than my existing AGM so should be an easy swap.