TSi MPG

[Mars2]

On my TSI 4motion with DSG I got better MPG after the remap due to more aggressive timing and sure also because DSG engage earlier next gear due to increase torque
But cruising on flat highway at 100mph I also see better MPG and their the DSG does nothing as it is anyway in 7TH gear at about 2700rpm ( from what I remenber Could be 2800rpm). If you have a remap where extra power is mostly coming from boost then you will see worse or same mpg. If you have a remap were gain come more from agressive timing specialy at part throttle then you will see better MPG.

If you know what remap you want to buy ask them what is their timing from 1000 rpm to red line. Or ask somebody who already got it to log it with Vagcom. then you know if it got more agressive timing or just more boost

 

[Carbon13]

Can anyone comment on MPG figures on a remapped TSI manual? Obviously going to be low if driving it like a 300bhp vehicle, but for normal driving was there much difference from standard?

Same as unmapped empty for me, add a campervan conversion dropped to 29-34 touring fully loaded, did 33 on a 4000 mile round trip to Spain.

 

[BognorMotors]

I only ran our TSI with the map and from 30 miles so basically new. But we had standard vans as well and fuel economy always seems similar. They drive a lot better mapped, it really frees the torque up.

 

[Richard f]

For sure a OEM K04-64 is really a bad option for a T6/T5 as the intake of the turbo is totally wrong for for those T5/T6 TSI .it's made for the engine bay architecture of Golf/ audi A3/TT plateforme . with the intake Turning 90° upward. But it's super easy option for Golf 6 GTI ( almost plug and play).
Their is plenty of turbo with the right design, hybrid's or you can reshape the K04-64 to fit the T6 engine bay architecture with a bit of cutting and welding on intake side.
Those stupid tuner that use K04-64 with the original layout of the Golf just did not do their home work and create lot of work to go around the problem because of their short study.
Creating new intake hose with stupid path, moving the dump valve..... just because they did not study the T5/T6 engine bay architecture before choosing a turbo.


I did a supercharger implementation with AWIC on My ex T5 V6 I did all my home work before and when I start the install it took me 48 hours with the instal of new cam's because all part's where already study, design and produce before starting the install.

When I will change Turbo on My T6 I expect it to be max 8 hour work. For sure I will not go K04-64 as it come from factory with a layup of the air intake tube that is totaly wrong direction for the T5/T6 TSI. with the right turbo it's easier than playing LEGO to upgrade the T5/T6 TSI to 400hp +

Stop to make simple thing like a turbo swap look complicated!!!! it's at the level of a children playing LEGO.
Engine swap are complicated. specialy when installing one from an other brand than the car you put this on. like LS1 in GT86

The down pipe and intake are at the same level as installing a new sink in your kitchen it's just hoses game. The ECU tuning part for a good tuning guy is peace of cake.
The OEM fueling system is good up to 420 hp so well above what a K04-64 can produce. if you want more midrange torque you can install an upgrade kit of your High pressure fuel pump. That will take you max 1 hour if you have two left hand. (did it in less than 30 minutes, 5 screws to unbolted and one hose to undo. I also had to swap injector's for my E85 project)

Hi mars2 have been looking at your posts about k04-64 which I know does not fit but will a k04-6758 fit as when talking to a uk hybrid turbo company they said the tsi turbo is not that good

 

[Mars2]

He I'm running with a turbozentrum Stage 2 T6 TSI hybride turbo since 1 year and a half. I did already 30.000Kmwith it.
it cost me 1000 Euro to get my OEM turbo hybridized.
I'm at the moment making +400BHP and 585Nm at 2500rpm I'm already at 160BHP and 410NM. But that is with E85 ( 85% ethanol + 15 % Gazoline) we can get E85 at gas station here in France.
With UK 99 gazoline i think you could make 360BHP and 500NM you can't run as much timing as I can with E85 because E85 burn cooler so almost impossible to get knock.
if you add Water methanol injection to your UK 99 may be you can get 380BHP of that turbozentrum hybrid.

Otherwise you have TTE450 can bring you north of 400 Bhp with UK 99 gazoline. But TTE 450 spool slower than Turbozentrum Stage 2
only 120BHP and 350NM at 2500 rpm and then at 3000rpm it get same as my Turbozentrum around 5500rpm but again I'm on E85 that is why I choose TZ to reach 400BHP and have very early spool.
With TTE 450 and E85 I could make around 450 BHP easy. but later spool and DSG in D like to stay in that 1500-2500rpm when you drive relaxe so torque in that rpm range is very nice to have.My T6 is T6 TSI DSG 4MOTION

https://www.facebook.com/TheTurboEngineers/posts/4072000776189652

PS: look like it does not accepte my link to FB. So if you want to see dyno of TTE450 go to Theturboengineers FB page and search their post from 16 April 2021

Both turbo are super easy to install as they are like OEM turbo so nothing to modify it just like getting a new OEM turbo.
To get max power you will need also the following:
- Wagner evo2 intercooler
- DTH Highflow down pipe 3.5" to 3" ( that is what I have) or an other smooth big section downpipe
- Scorpion 2"3/4 resonated cat back. I had Miltek first but much too load with bigger turbo and down pipe. the Miltek resonator is a fake resonator.
- A good tune ( that mean no Pendle) Oh yess with Pendle Dyno you might see 500HP

Hope that help.

 

[Richard f]

He I'm running with a turbozentrum Stage 2 T6 TSI hybride turbo since 1 year and a half. I did already 30.000Kmwith it.
it cost me 1000 Euro to get my OEM turbo hybridized.
I'm at the moment making +400BHP and 585Nm at 2500rpm I'm already at 160BHP and 410NM. But that is with E85 ( 85% ethanol + 15 % Gazoline) we can get E85 at gas station here in France.
With UK 99 gazoline i think you could make 360BHP and 500NM you can't run as much timing as I can with E85 because E85 burn cooler so almost impossible to get knock.
if you add Water methanol injection to your UK 99 may be you can get 380BHP of that turbozentrum hybrid.

Otherwise you have TTE450 can bring you north of 400 Bhp with UK 99 gazoline. But TTE 450 spool slower than Turbozentrum Stage 2
only 120BHP and 350NM at 2500 rpm and then at 3000rpm it get same as my Turbozentrum around 5500rpm but again I'm on E85 that is why I choose TZ to reach 400BHP and have very early spool.
With TTE 450 and E85 I could make around 450 BHP easy. but later spool and DSG in D like to stay in that 1500-2500rpm when you drive relaxe so torque in that rpm range is very nice to have.My T6 is T6 TSI DSG 4MOTION

https://www.facebook.com/TheTurboEngineers/posts/4072000776189652

PS: look like it does not accepte my link to FB. So if you want to see dyno of TTE450 go to Theturboengineers FB page and search their post from 16 April 2021

Both turbo are super easy to install as they are like OEM turbo so nothing to modify it just like getting a new OEM turbo.
To get max power you will need also the following:
- Wagner evo2 intercooler
- DTH Highflow down pipe 3.5" to 3" ( that is what I have) or an other smooth big section downpipe
- Scorpion 2"3/4 resonated cat back. I had Miltek first but much too load with bigger turbo and down pipe. the Miltek resonator is a fake resonator.
- A good tune ( that mean no Pendle) Oh yess with Pendle Dyno you might see 500HP

Hope that help.

Hi want i am looking for is to put in a new turbo but which one to use the k04 come in lots of lay outs . Have you looked in to which one would suit the transporter best .

 

[Mars2]

Sorry I thought you wanted to get more power.

Only the The K04-064 has same integrated exhaust manifold as OEM T6 TSI IHI JH5. So only this one can be made to fit. It's the turbo from GOLF VI R with EA113 engine
we have EA888.2
But to fit it because the compressor housing is very different outside shape (because different engine bay layup ) you will have to get custom pipe for:
- Turbo to intake
- Turbo to IC
- relocate dump valve. Or nee to milled the KO4 and cnc adapter to fit the dump valve on the compressor housing like on picture below.

IHI JH5 Hybrid from turbozentrum, TTE.... are plug and play as they modify our original Turbo.
When they modify your oem turbo they change every thing except the shell so you get basically new turbo:
-New turbine wheel and shaft
-New reinforced bearing
-New compressor wheel
-Compressor housing milled to fit the new bigger wheel
-Turbine wheel milled to fit bigger wheel on TTE ( Not TZ it's a stage 2)
-Renew and modify waste gate with stronger spring. Cracking pressure at 8psi ( oem cracking pressure is 4 psi)


I bought on EBAY Poland a used turbo from a T5 TSI IHI JH5 ( same turbo as T6 TSI) for 200Euro with weak bearing and shaft and got it modify to stage 2 by Turbozentrum.
Like that I kept my old turbo in case I want to go back to oem turbo and I just had the car out of the road for one day.
I started the turbo swap in morning, end of the day the T6 was back on the road. I need my Van daily for work.


Here on picture you can see how the compressor housing layup is different from K04-064 to T5/T6 IHI JH5. K04-064 on the left
See that the tube going up on the T5/T6 is the existe of the turbo and the one going on K04-064 is the intake of the this turbo.
So need to work on pipe to fit.

 

[Mars2]

Forgot my TZ Hybrid on VCDS get exactly same MAF reading as the guy's in USA with Audi B8/B8.5 (same AE888.2 engine) with K04-064 B&W turbo kit.
Around 295G.s of MAF on VCDS or about 36Lb/mn of flow.

36LB/mn is about 360BHP on GDI engine according to Garrett and Borg&Warner you should have a 10 to 10.5 ratio from Lb to BHP depending of how agressive is your timing.
With E85 according to them on GDI it's 11 to 11.5

 

[Mars2]

Then when you start to study compressor map, turbo flow, flow to BHP ratio you understand very fast that Pendle is full of B.S with their stage 2 T6 TSI at 347BHP
How in a real world can a compressor wheel with 40.2mm inducer and 52.5mm exducer (T5/T6 compressor wheel size) produce over 340 BHP!!!
I would love to see any compressor wheel map of this size having the potential to producing 34lb/mn when you plot the RPM line on that compressor map
this way way out of compressor efficiency of such a wheel.

PS: K04-064 has compressor wheel with 46.4mm Inducer/ 56mm exducer and 60mm extended tip

 

[coullstar]

You mentioned a Scorpion exhaust but I don't see a Tsi listed.

 

[Mars2]

they are all same TDi TSI....

you will just need the adapter from Miltek.
Adapter between Down pipe and center box.
I kept it when I sent back the Miltek exhaust that was much too noisy and drowning

 

[SteS]

Then when you start to study compressor map, turbo flow, flow to BHP ratio you understand very fast that Pendle is full of B.S with their stage 2 T6 TSI at 347BHP
How in a real world can a compressor wheel with 40.2mm inducer and 52.5mm exducer (T5/T6 compressor wheel size) produce over 340 BHP!!!
I would love to see any compressor wheel map of this size having the potential to producing 34lb/mn when you plot the RPM line on that compressor map
this way way out of compressor efficiency of such a wheel.

PS: K04-064 has compressor wheel with 46.4mm Inducer/ 56mm exducer and 60mm extended tip

Hi Mars2, I’ve got a T5 4Motion TSI with DSG running a stage 2 revo map, but looking to take this to stage 3.

I see the bolt on turbos are now for sale in the UK but can’t seem to find a decent company who can do the mapping. Ideally would like switchable maps if possible.

I’ve upgraded the intercooler exhaust and brakes so it’s ready to go.

I see you are not in the UK but appreciate any recommendations if you know of any.

Cheers, Ste

 

[Mars2]

Where do you leave? In UK. MRC would be the best I Guess.
I don't know anybody that offer multimap in Europe for the MED17.1.1 of the T5/ T6 Tsi.
Would love to find somebody who does.
But as T5/T6 TSI market is small I'm not sure anybody will ever spend the time to develop it for our MED17.1.1. Too much work.

What are the bolt on option in UK? TTE, Turbozentrum, TTH? Or do you have other's than those 3

 

[SteS]

Where do you leave? In UK. MRC would be the best I Guess.
I don't know anybody that offer multimap in Europe for the MED17.1.1 of the T5/ T6 Tsi.
Would love to find somebody who does.
But as T5/T6 TSI market is small I'm not sure anybody will ever spend the time to develop it for our MED17.1.1. Too much work.

What are the bolt on option in UK? TTE, Turbozentrum, TTH? Or do you have other's than those 3

Hi Thanks for the reply,

Yes i'm in the UK midlands.

Good shout on MRC, ill give them a try.

Most companies only do the REVO maps, so they dont have the stage 3 turbo that can fit the transporter. Then the only other company I came across was Pendle.

The only one I have seen for sale is the TTE, most other companies just offer a custom hybrid.

Which turbo would you recommend?

 

[Mars2]

TTE is good.
With TTE you will need custom tune.

I will stay as far away as possible of Pendle. Unless you want a dyno chart saying you made 1000hp

MRC are super serious and did already some VWT6 TSI with TTE. Look on their face book page 14 october 2020

 

[Mars2]

REVO has a stage 3 file for your van. But I would go custom tuning.

REVO Stage 3 Software for a VOLKSWAGEN Transporter T5 2.0 TSI

www.onlyrevo.com

 

[jaro]

Hello,
at EcuProject Wrocław on 02/12/2021 is my t6 withTTE 450. I agree with Mars2 - engine program only on request from a good tuner

 

[Mars2]

Nice HP numberJaro.
But why do they keep the torque so low at low rpm?
Maybe you have 2WD and that is why.

I have 4Motion and get 585Nm max and already at 470NM at 2500 rpm and 530Nm at 3000rpm.
My best 1/4 mile until now 13.94 s but I don't have Launch control activated yet?
Maybe 13.6 or 13.7 when I get the launch control activated.

 

[Mars2]

I have a turbo hybrid from turbozentrum it's a bit smaller than TTE450.

Since my van was new I always go to the same Dyno for each stage.
Oem, Stage 1 , Stage 2, Stage 3.... so I have same base.
It is not the dyno from my tuner like that it's more neutral. But I get about same number on the Dyno from my tuner.

Here a Dyno from my Van. We have to pass it in 2 wheel drive (unplug haldex fuse) because the LWB 4motion is too long for the most Dyno's
this day it was sleeping on the dyno. why the bump at high rpm. the operator did not tight is well as he did not expect a T6 to make this kind of power.
I pay 50 euro each time for 2 pass on the Dyno.
I have to go back their with the new mod to see where I'm.

 

[SteS]

TTE is good.
With TTE you will need custom tune.

I will stay as far away as possible of Pendle. Unless you want a dyno chart saying you made 1000hp

MRC are super serious and did already some VWT6 TSI with TTE. Look on their face book page 14 october 2020

View attachment 145437

Thanks for this, looks like MRC are fairly local to me. I would be happy with these figures to be fair.

This is my VAN at Revo which the stage 2 map was made for. Wanted to go for stage 3 but the K04 doesnt actually fit my VAN