The gas hasn't tripped on my Moka yet
What Coffee Machine do you have in your van?
- Thread starter Drive Wayne
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- coffee
For all you nespresso/tassimo fans. You’re only playing at it 
Yes but you will need a very different EHU setup if you bypass the Clayton to be safe and compliant, the Clayton is currently handling all that and keeping your EHU super simple.
Unless you want to start somewhat from scratch I'd find another way of making coffee...
So would this not be safe enough just to make a coffee and then pack it back away? extension lead
No because you have mains electricity in a metal bodied van and there are different requirements for grounding on inverter Vs on EHU. If you bypass the Clayton as you have wired it you will have no RCD protection in the van and most sites would regard your EHU as dangerous because of that.
Having both EHU and Inverter supply the interior sockets is complex and needs relays to change the earthing arrangement. The Clayton is doing all that, it's one of the benefits of the expense. Replicating all outside of the Clayton so you can run a coffee machine occasionally isn't a sensible use of the space/budget.
Try a small Nespresso, they make good coffee too.
Its for her indoors, she can have a cup of tea instead
Thanks as always for your knowledge
Afaik all “compliant” EHUs have an RCD in the post. I don’t think that T6chris is proposing to run the additional EHU & the inverter in parallel. More like a standalone EHU just to run the coffee machine. No different to running an EHU in a tent.
A tent isn't a metal bodied van though.
Chris and I had a conversation with Clayton about this and the relays in there are doing the correct PE/N bonding as the Clayton moves between Inverter and EHU - thus he has no independent RCD in the van side of the EHU and the van body is grounded very specifically to the output side of the Clayton.
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Just to be clear as well, the extension would be plugged in, make a coffee and then unplugged. I wont be using it for anything else.
I suppose a way to iradicate any danger would be to make the coffee on a table outside whilst using the EHU. I could change machine BUT she loves those tassimo pods
I suppose a way to iradicate any danger would be to make the coffee on a table outside whilst using the EHU. I could change machine BUT she loves those tassimo pods
Surely that has got to be safe RT? Those Tassimo pods are wonderful!Just to be clear as well, the extension would be plugged in, make a coffee and then unplugged. I wont be using it for anything else.
I suppose a way to iradicate any danger would be to make the coffee on a table outside whilst using the EHU. I could change machine BUT she loves those tassimo pods
Uh-oh - the desire for something to be true taking precedence over the reality that it's not. Now where have I heard that ideology before?
If you used an independent tent EHU (with local RCD) with it and all loads outside of the van body then as @Salty Spuds notes you'd be in the same position as a tent and just as safe.
The risk comes when there is a chance of a wiring fault meaning that the body of the van goes live, for instance a EHU cable put through the tailgate/bonnet and catches on an exposed bolt or panel edge. As the van body is well insulated from the ground by the tyres there is no path to ground so no RCD will trip, but anyone touching the van with feet on the ground is a potential fault current path.
Normally this is addressed by grounding the van body to the protective earth of the incoming EHU, giving a path to ground, so any fault current will trip the RCD in the van consumer unit. A tent based EHU put in temporarily will not have this grounding so it's RCD protection will not work.
As @Salty Spuds notes there is often an upstream RCD as well, however generally they will be slower acting to give discrimination - it's expected that the RCD at your end of the EHU will trip first if you have a fault, not the one in the distribution point that may turn off others. The role of the distribution point RCD is to protect people from faults in the cable between the point and your EHU system.
As in all these things you need a number of things to go wrong and line up for a tragedy to happen and in the UK regulations keep a number of layers present. The same is true of aircraft but they still have accidents when a number of unlikely risks line up and often it's found that some of the protection has been disabled or ignored as "unlikely"
Would I use a tent EHU in a van without grounding it? Maybe if it was once or twice a year (minimise the risk by not doing it often) and being very careful to check the wire for damage. I don't think I'd be happy doing it regularly, and I'd expect any commercial site owner who saw me doing it to ask me not to.
If you want to do this "properly" then you will need to replace your basic 16A to Powercon arrangement to the Clayton with a normal complete grounded EHU install with RCD and 2 breakers - one to feed the Clayton and one to feed an additional EHU only socket in the van.
The risk comes when there is a chance of a wiring fault meaning that the body of the van goes live, for instance a EHU cable put through the tailgate/bonnet and catches on an exposed bolt or panel edge. As the van body is well insulated from the ground by the tyres there is no path to ground so no RCD will trip, but anyone touching the van with feet on the ground is a potential fault current path.
Normally this is addressed by grounding the van body to the protective earth of the incoming EHU, giving a path to ground, so any fault current will trip the RCD in the van consumer unit. A tent based EHU put in temporarily will not have this grounding so it's RCD protection will not work.
As @Salty Spuds notes there is often an upstream RCD as well, however generally they will be slower acting to give discrimination - it's expected that the RCD at your end of the EHU will trip first if you have a fault, not the one in the distribution point that may turn off others. The role of the distribution point RCD is to protect people from faults in the cable between the point and your EHU system.
As in all these things you need a number of things to go wrong and line up for a tragedy to happen and in the UK regulations keep a number of layers present. The same is true of aircraft but they still have accidents when a number of unlikely risks line up and often it's found that some of the protection has been disabled or ignored as "unlikely"
Would I use a tent EHU in a van without grounding it? Maybe if it was once or twice a year (minimise the risk by not doing it often) and being very careful to check the wire for damage. I don't think I'd be happy doing it regularly, and I'd expect any commercial site owner who saw me doing it to ask me not to.
If you want to do this "properly" then you will need to replace your basic 16A to Powercon arrangement to the Clayton with a normal complete grounded EHU install with RCD and 2 breakers - one to feed the Clayton and one to feed an additional EHU only socket in the van.
Chris! If we are ever on the same site, I'll happily make your Mrs a coffee! Just give me a pod she likes! The Tassimo makes some lovely girly coffees for wives that prefer a less strong brew!
I use a Moka pot in the van & at home. Cheap, great coffee & no plastic waste. Personally I don’t get the “pod” thing, but that’s just me.I wonder if there is a gas equivalent to this conversation for those that use a Moka for their brew - tent or van which is safest
The Lavazza pods are now all compostable. So no plastic waste to harm anything. Also used coffee is good to dig into your garden so a win win situation
'Dig into your garden'...
Nothing comes up on Google translate for that!
Plus I haven't got a Lavazza...
Plastic waste for me, to go with my diesel van.
Nothing comes up on Google translate for that!
Plus I haven't got a Lavazza...
Plastic waste for me, to go with my diesel van.
How to Use Coffee Grounds for Plants | BBC Gardeners World Magazine
Advice on when and how to use coffee grounds on plants. Expert advice from BBC Gardeners' World Magazine.
www.gardenersworld.com
Oh @denz1968 ,my virtually fossilised neighbour Steve despairs at my complete lack of enthusiasm for 'doing my garden', both front and back! I am fortunate that his life is his garden, and when not a single cricket match is showing on Sky he will tend a couple of my small flowery beds at the front and create the most beautiful hanging baskets to put the less fortunate neighbours to shame during the season. I have a small hope, in 20 years, that I too may enjoy retirement enough to don a tatty straw hat and wear the same scruffy old clothes and share his absolute passion for things that grow, reacting in a positive way to his every green fingered caress.
Presently I would much rather take a clay bar to my van and furtle with its fascinations.
I do love to relapse in a nicely mown (by me) garden, but that is as far as I go.
My apologies Denz for letting the side down!
Presently I would much rather take a clay bar to my van and furtle with its fascinations.
I do love to relapse in a nicely mown (by me) garden, but that is as far as I go.
My apologies Denz for letting the side down!
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