It works for me, had low leisure battery voltage in the middle of the night (no solar), 5 minutes running the engine and I had enough to get the Wallas running. 2016 Bluemotion.
Renogy 12V Lithium ion battery - Sargent EC160
- Thread starter Ian1966
- Start date
I think even with a split charger setup on a smart alternator you'll get output from the alternator after the engine has just finished cranking and/or if it's cold enough weather but then that voltage can be up to 18volts. The comment was made as part of the reply to @Ian1966 who like me has a Redline conversion camper with their split charge relay rather than the B2B it should have been fitted with.
Do you also have intentions of adding an inverter to go to 240v or are you still planning/able to use the current EHU via the Sargent?
Funny you should ask as I've been stewing on this one a bit!
Renogy do a 3kw inverter for £320 which can be fed from a 230v AC supply ie. EHU as well as a 12v DC supply much like a UPS works for mains back up.... then I have a reality check and remember I've got a gas hob, a 12V fridge, 12V lights and a Webasto heater meaning I would be rigging up a 230V off grid supply just to run the power supply on a laptop... basically it's easy to get carried away!
Renogy do a 3kw inverter for £320 which can be fed from a 230v AC supply ie. EHU as well as a 12v DC supply much like a UPS works for mains back up.... then I have a reality check and remember I've got a gas hob, a 12V fridge, 12V lights and a Webasto heater meaning I would be rigging up a 230V off grid supply just to run the power supply on a laptop... basically it's easy to get carried away!
Lol i feel ya pain, I’ve been following advice and get carried away with £££ toting up !!! Want to go with lithium battery and 50a DC/DC and see how the off grid works out.
Hopefully the EHU via Sargent will used as back up?
We've already booked a few trips away this year and all have hook ups until mid July as that's what was on offer, the missus did question why I had even pushed to go off grid but the idea was not to cark the leisure battery and lose the fridge on day two of a no hook up week away.
I won't get rid of the Sargent as it's a decent enough distribution board but some of my remaining hairs are falling out fretting over how to integrate the benefits of both systems ie. hooked up and off grid powered.
Thanks to this forum and it's members there's a shed load of anecdotal advice from existing working setups so you'll soon find there's no two identical systems let alone the perfect system.
I won't get rid of the Sargent as it's a decent enough distribution board but some of my remaining hairs are falling out fretting over how to integrate the benefits of both systems ie. hooked up and off grid powered.
Thanks to this forum and it's members there's a shed load of anecdotal advice from existing working setups so you'll soon find there's no two identical systems let alone the perfect system.
How are you getting on Frosty! Any updates?
I'm plodding through the diagrams that come with the bits of kit I've bought and the Sargent booklet that came with the van from Redline.
I had the seat out yesterday to remove the dying lead acid battery and found a few more wires than I was expecting so a bit more of an headache... thinking about it though they might be for the Webasto diesel heater as that's under the floor there just looks that these wires will need protecting from the weight of the battery plus I'll probably need to run one or two new feeds to this position when doing away with the existing Sargent battery charger feed to the leisure battery.
I was hoping you would blaze the trail so I could learn by your mistakes but in all fairness I've got the battery, the dc50, the smart charger and two solar panels, no wiring or fuses yet and I'm bound to need a shunt plus display to check the battery state... been putting this off since Busfest last year although I did only get the battery at Christmas
I had the seat out yesterday to remove the dying lead acid battery and found a few more wires than I was expecting so a bit more of an headache... thinking about it though they might be for the Webasto diesel heater as that's under the floor there just looks that these wires will need protecting from the weight of the battery plus I'll probably need to run one or two new feeds to this position when doing away with the existing Sargent battery charger feed to the leisure battery.
I was hoping you would blaze the trail so I could learn by your mistakes but in all fairness I've got the battery, the dc50, the smart charger and two solar panels, no wiring or fuses yet and I'm bound to need a shunt plus display to check the battery state... been putting this off since Busfest last year although I did only get the battery at Christmas
I thought I’d let you show me the way! Only fair I thought you have more knowledge being sparky than I do. I’ve got mechanic mate who is going to help me but want to make sure what I’m buying will be correct and work!
Did you consider AGM battery?
I'll be honest I was a bread and butter sparky not the tech savvy bright young things you see on YouTube in their designer site wear and there genuinely is a difference between sparkies and auto electricians... and I are a bit thick!
AGM batteries are still lead acid and as such will wilt at about 50% of their claimed Amp Hour output meaning you get two days absolute max running that 100Ah AGM powered Waeco fridge in summer when not on hook up, the Lithium though will virtually poop every last drop of electric back out by comparison so on a 100Ah lithium you could run that Waeco for nearly four days.
Lee @Dellmassive is the man to watch for tech insight and I'm reading and re-reading his Under seat battery install thread to get a better grip on what's got to be done, I will post how it goes especially as I've got most of the bigger bits already, just as a thought Renogy are having a bit of a push at the moment and knocking prices down a bit to the point their 170Ah lithium iron phosphate battery is pretty good value.
AGM batteries are still lead acid and as such will wilt at about 50% of their claimed Amp Hour output meaning you get two days absolute max running that 100Ah AGM powered Waeco fridge in summer when not on hook up, the Lithium though will virtually poop every last drop of electric back out by comparison so on a 100Ah lithium you could run that Waeco for nearly four days.
Lee @Dellmassive is the man to watch for tech insight and I'm reading and re-reading his Under seat battery install thread to get a better grip on what's got to be done, I will post how it goes especially as I've got most of the bigger bits already, just as a thought Renogy are having a bit of a push at the moment and knocking prices down a bit to the point their 170Ah lithium iron phosphate battery is pretty good value.
Have you completed your battery upgrade frosty? I’ve got new 50a DCDC charger just waiting on lithium battery to turn up and will be hopefully set up for a bit of off grid camping!
Funny you should ask chap I'm part way through the process and have ordered some wire, fuses and battery isolator from Amazon.
I've figured out how Redline did their wiring and it's not the best but at least I now know what goes where, the fridge and Webasto are both straight off the leisure battery, the Webasto fused by the battery and the fridge feed (2.5mm2) going unfused behind the kitchen units until it gets to the Sargent panel fused way and then back to the fridge.
Anyway the VSR is out as is the lead acid battery leaving acres of space which I filled with the Roamer, there's about 70mm of space between the Roamer and seat base sides and about 100mm at the front although this slopes so I've done a bit of panel beating and made an upright front to the seat base in aluminium sheet.
This new upright panel will carry the B2B/mppt charger inside the seat base and the battery isolator and a small blade fuseboard for the Webasto and fridge plus anything else on the outside of the seat base where it's easy to get at.
The wire I've ordered is for the various links under the seat in 6 guage and some 10 guage to extend the solar panels from the back of the van entry point to the seat base... it is doing my head in a bit as there's other stuff like a shunt that could go in but where to stop, I'll post some pictures of the carnage when I next get on the laptop, Dave.
I've figured out how Redline did their wiring and it's not the best but at least I now know what goes where, the fridge and Webasto are both straight off the leisure battery, the Webasto fused by the battery and the fridge feed (2.5mm2) going unfused behind the kitchen units until it gets to the Sargent panel fused way and then back to the fridge.
Anyway the VSR is out as is the lead acid battery leaving acres of space which I filled with the Roamer, there's about 70mm of space between the Roamer and seat base sides and about 100mm at the front although this slopes so I've done a bit of panel beating and made an upright front to the seat base in aluminium sheet.
This new upright panel will carry the B2B/mppt charger inside the seat base and the battery isolator and a small blade fuseboard for the Webasto and fridge plus anything else on the outside of the seat base where it's easy to get at.
The wire I've ordered is for the various links under the seat in 6 guage and some 10 guage to extend the solar panels from the back of the van entry point to the seat base... it is doing my head in a bit as there's other stuff like a shunt that could go in but where to stop, I'll post some pictures of the carnage when I next get on the laptop, Dave.
cool, pictures would be good to see. I’ve only be sorting out and taking the plunge and buying at moment!
I’m i correct in thinking you also have charger on EHU side of things for lithium battery or will existing setup do the job?
Cheers Ian
Yes Ian, when you take the woodwork apart in the wardrobe it's easier to see the wiring to the back of the Sargent unit and you can get to the MCB connections.
I've put a Victron 12/30 smart charger on the side of the fridge housing at low level behind the drivers seat with a single 230V skt feed that's fed from MCB 2 on the Sargent behind the cupboards with blue 2.5mm2 arctic flex like they've used on the two skts on the side of the wardrobe.
The Sargent charger is disabled by pulling the fuse on the unit and disconnecting the feed to the starter battery from the rear of the Sargent unit as this cable was a 2 core flex I've cut both cores to the same length and spliced them together to use as a single wire into the leisure battery connection bearing in mind each single core was only 2.5mm2 so a bit puny.
I've put a Victron 12/30 smart charger on the side of the fridge housing at low level behind the drivers seat with a single 230V skt feed that's fed from MCB 2 on the Sargent behind the cupboards with blue 2.5mm2 arctic flex like they've used on the two skts on the side of the wardrobe.
The Sargent charger is disabled by pulling the fuse on the unit and disconnecting the feed to the starter battery from the rear of the Sargent unit as this cable was a 2 core flex I've cut both cores to the same length and spliced them together to use as a single wire into the leisure battery connection bearing in mind each single core was only 2.5mm2 so a bit puny.
Pictures...
The panel around the front of the seat base will be pop rivetted on in about 4 places just at the top and sides, I folded a small internal return of about 20mm on the bottom edge to add strength but the aluminium itself was one of those panels you get from Toolstation/Screwfix to use as a kickboard along the bottom of a door, as an old school Blue Peter fan I covered the ally with sticky backed plastic and will use it as an advent calendar next year.
You can't see it but there's a conventional white single skt on a pvc surface box to the right of the Victron smart charger, the leads from the charger weave across the floor and under the seat base to emerge at the side of the Roamer.
I've got some pretty ANL fuses for the fatter cables and I'm going to try to set them in the top of that seat pocket on a bit of carpetted mdf... this is taking me back to the early noughties and my street bass days!
The panel around the front of the seat base will be pop rivetted on in about 4 places just at the top and sides, I folded a small internal return of about 20mm on the bottom edge to add strength but the aluminium itself was one of those panels you get from Toolstation/Screwfix to use as a kickboard along the bottom of a door, as an old school Blue Peter fan I covered the ally with sticky backed plastic and will use it as an advent calendar next year.
You can't see it but there's a conventional white single skt on a pvc surface box to the right of the Victron smart charger, the leads from the charger weave across the floor and under the seat base to emerge at the side of the Roamer.
I've got some pretty ANL fuses for the fatter cables and I'm going to try to set them in the top of that seat pocket on a bit of carpetted mdf... this is taking me back to the early noughties and my street bass days!
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Well done looks neat and tidy liking the idea of the door kick plate! Is it all working as you’d hoped?
Once my Renogy lithium battery arrives I’ll share mine as well. Not got the knowledge you’ve got so hoping my sons mate who’s top mechanic will help me no end !
Any reason you went for Roamer? I’ve brought both charger and battery from Renogy.
1mperialSoldier
New Member
Hi, did you get the renogy charger and Sargent to work together? I have the EC155 and just bought the renogy charger. My plan is to add the solar panels at a later date but I'm unsure where to tap the renogy charger onto the Sargent. I've read on another thread that the charger fuse in the Sargent is taken out to stop both trying to charge
Removing the charger fuse will isolate the Sargent internal charger.
I've got the EC160 unit but it's the same deal, if you've got a Durite or similar ignition controlled split charge relay under the drivers seat with the existing leisure battery then that will need removing and the ignition trigger wire connecting to your B2B charger along with the alternator incoming feed (VW 75A fused fattish black wire) and your outgoing leisure battery fat wire feed.
Put fuses everywhere and a big ie 300A battery isolator switch at the leisure battery to prevent back leakage through the charger, inverter or any other kit that will drain the leisure battery when not in use or when you want to connect additional stuff to the battery safely.
I added a Renogy shunt with remote display to show what's going in/out and remaining duration on my setup and it's a great graphical indication of the leisure battery state of play rather than slightly misleading phone apps and Bluetooth combo.
I've got the EC160 unit but it's the same deal, if you've got a Durite or similar ignition controlled split charge relay under the drivers seat with the existing leisure battery then that will need removing and the ignition trigger wire connecting to your B2B charger along with the alternator incoming feed (VW 75A fused fattish black wire) and your outgoing leisure battery fat wire feed.
Put fuses everywhere and a big ie 300A battery isolator switch at the leisure battery to prevent back leakage through the charger, inverter or any other kit that will drain the leisure battery when not in use or when you want to connect additional stuff to the battery safely.
I added a Renogy shunt with remote display to show what's going in/out and remaining duration on my setup and it's a great graphical indication of the leisure battery state of play rather than slightly misleading phone apps and Bluetooth combo.
Should add that the existing wires from the Sargent units 12V charger output are also the wires that bring in the 12V to the Sargent to distribute power out to your various 12V equipment, fridge, water pump etc so will need to be reused in some form.
On my Redline conversion I did away with the starter battery charger output from the Sargent and doubled it up with the leisure battery output wire as the cable size they had used was pretty puny.
On my Redline conversion I did away with the starter battery charger output from the Sargent and doubled it up with the leisure battery output wire as the cable size they had used was pretty puny.
My set up finished up like this...
The Sargent unit is now connected via a 30A fuse on that mini blade fuseboard shown which is under the drivers seat with the LifePo4 leisure battery.
The Sargent unit is now connected via a 30A fuse on that mini blade fuseboard shown which is under the drivers seat with the LifePo4 leisure battery.
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