Fixing my van's lack of security

[andys]

I think the giffgaff payg are goood for that purpose

Looked like a good deal but I've just found out it uses the O2 network, which is the very worst in the areas I frequent, I would literally have to drive 5 miles from my house to get 1 bar on O2. They're not as good on deals, but it's got to be Vodafone so I've ordered one from them. Can't access the GSM module any other way than through cellular so I can't experiment with it at the moment .

Day off today so time to get that door card off and let's have a look at these locks.

 

[andys]

Well that went well Took the door card off and then removed all the bolts holding the inner metal panel before I realised all the window mechanism and various other bits were attached, so I came in and got the Haynes T5 manual out to see how it all came apart. Reading through it looked a lot more involved than I thought and I wasn't confident that I could get it all out and then replaced by the end of the day with only two hands, and as I might be taking my granddaughter away in a couple of weeks and don't have any spare time before then I decided to leave it until Nov/Dec when I won't be using the van and can leave it half finished in the garage if I run out of time.

I then did what I probably should have done a while ago and looked at the wiring diagrams in the back as I presume not much has changed in the locking mechanism from the T5, given the part nos are the same. Turns out there are different control modules and several wiring differences for vehicles with Safelock operation that are spread throughout the van, so I give up, changing the locks isn't going to do anything so there's no point in proceeding. Adding deadlocking to a van without it is just not feasible so I'm going to concentrate on increasing the "features" of the alarm. Wasted £80 on the locks but it was always a doubtful punt and at least they fit T5/5.1/6 so I should be able to get rid of them on ebay with a bit of luck.
I probed all the wires leaving the door lock area and couldn't find a single one that changed its voltage when the door is shut or locked. I'll have to do some trawling through the wiring diagrams now because without a way to trigger a "door open" signal, my internal sensor circuit won't work.

While I had the door card off I investigated a couple of little rattles I had heard, despite it being heavily Dynamatted. Tracked these down to the plastic cover for the Rainbow crossover, which was fixed with a thin bead of silicone, and also this little connector block.


Wrapped this in a thin layer of foam and tightly fastened it and surrounding wires to the door. No more rattles, so at least I've had one small achievement today.

And then as I closed the van up I saw this deep scratch next to the sliding door handle

Can only have been me, presumably with a screwdriver or something in my hand as I opened the door.

 

[Pauly]

I had a look at the wiring diagrams in regards to deadlocking and couldnt see much difference, i thought it would just be a case of swapping the lock units and enabling it in VCDS ?
If you want to pursue it mate im happy to go through the wiring diagrams with you and see if we can figure it out, shoot me a PM if your interested and i will sort the wiring diagrams out

 

[Loz]

its in the download section Convenience Systems

 

[andys]

Thanks @Pauly and @Loz , I don't know how much more ripping apart of a 6 month old van I dare do. I'll have a good scan through that and see if I can understand any of it. The Haynes diagram shows a bewildering tangle of connections marked "for vehicles with Safelock" , I certainly couldn't follow what was going on but those T6 diagrams do seem a bit clearer.

 

[Oldrat]

Although the tech side has been beyond me at times I've read through this thread with interest and I've come to the following conclusion....




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Buying a large dog seems much less hassle

 

[andys]

Got around to starting on the locks today, and although after spending most of the day on it I got the driver's side door lock swapped over and opening and closing ok, as soon as I locked it it stuck shut and now won't open whatever I do to unlock or pull cables inside or out. I'll take the inside of the door and window stuff out again tomorrow night and see if I can get it to open from that side but if not it'll have to go to a garage for them to do it. I think it may be to do with the 2nd hand locks I got off ebay, they look like they've had a hard life and one of them is dated 2005! When (if) this comes out I think I'll have to order some brand new ones.

So anyway, the detective work continues. After watching countless Youtube vids and reading everything I can find, it seems that there are indeed two versions of the lock, one with deadlocking that is normally fitted to European vehicles, and one without that is fitted to VW/Audi vehicles in the states and other areas where deadlocking is banned for safety reasons.
The only difference between them is an extra microswitch that is present on Safelock versions and missing from the others. At the (almost guaranteed ) risk that I wouldn't be able to get them back together again properly, I decided to take the locks apart and confirm for myself what I have.

First, the "xxxAA" lock from Ebay showing the extra microswitch

Then my lock


Bingo! The odd thing is though, I can't see anything that would touch the microswitch in the motor's range of travel but there it is.

That's not the end of it though, although there's precious little out there regarding T5/6 locks, there's plenty for Golfs, Passats, Seats etc all using an identical lock mechanism and it seems that the microswitch is the only extra part of essentially a "dumb" lock and the actual door control module that runs the Safelock is part of the electronics contained in...

the window motor...

For flip's sake!

Are you able to confirm this @Pauly or @Loz ?

 

[Loz]

Yes the module we program for say folding mirrors is attached to the window motor.

 

[andys]

Yes the module we program for say folding mirrors is attached to the window motor.

Thanks, is it possible to just change the module or do I need complete window motors? VCDS says my modules are not compatible with Safelock function and only list folding mirrors

 

[Pauly]

Sure your not misinterpreting that ?
The output test/function may not have been available because the device is not programmed/active

 

[Loz]

The odd thing is though, I can't see anything that would touch the microswitch in the motor's range of travel but there it is.?

See this photo of a dealock version, it has an extra piece below the slider. When the motor first operates the slider and locks the door, then the motor turns again and the centre part of the slider moves against the spring and operates the deadlock bar to jam the slider and press that other microswitch.

 

[andys]

Sure your not misinterpreting that ?
The output test/function may not have been available because the device is not programmed/active

I don’t know, it’s going to be down to comparing part nos again I suppose. But all the stuff I’ve watched and read seems to suggest that the BCM leaves the deadlocking control to the door control module on the window motor and I can’t find an option to program mine for anything other than folding mirrors and “window regulator blocked with terminal 15 off” - unless that’s it? Pic below


Does the door module of a deadlocking van show any more options?

 

[andys]

See this photo of a dealock version, it has an extra piece below the slider. When the motor first operates the slider and locks the door, then the motor turns again and the centre part of the slider moves against the spring and operates the deadlock bar to jam the slider and press that other microswitch.
View attachment 14895

That’s one of the videos I watched and I didn’t notice that. That means that the locks I’ve bought, despite being the right part no and having the correct circuit board, don’t deadlock as they don’t have that extra bit. They were exactly as in my first pic, nothing had been taken out or fallen out. So what I need is locks with that part no to fit a van that already has central locking. One YouTuber actually does refer to making sure your lock is the right colour as well as part no or there may be incompatibilities and mine isn’t.

 

[Pauly]

Send me a full scan will do some digging and comparing this week

 

[andys]

Send me a full scan will do some digging and comparing this week

Thanks. Just paste it into a PM?

 

[Loz]

Have you got it unlocked?
Did you try turning the key in the lock manually? (Past the switch position)

 

[andys]

Have you got it unlocked?
Did you try turning the key in the lock manually? (Past the switch position)

Not got it unlocked. Yes I tried everything I could think of and that I found on youtube. It was fine til I tried to lock it so I'm wondering if it's an incompatibility between the lock and the control module. I'm at work now but I'm going to pull the door interior back out tonight and try unplugging the wiring from it to see if that works. If not I'm just going to poke and prod at the back and see if I can triggger something.

 

[Loz]

The key is mechanically connected to the lock slider (you may have seen in the videos on youtube, so you should be able to turn the key in the lock a full 90degs and drive the lock slider over.

And for future reference, simulate the closing of the door by using a large screwdriver in the catch with the door open

 

[andys]

The key is mechanically connected to the lock slider so you should be able to turn the key in the lock a full 90degs and drive the lock slider over.

I'm pretty sure I tried turning it in both directions and I could hear the whir as it moved but the door still wouldn't open. I don't know whether it's staying locked or if it's the latch itself that jammed shut.

 

[Loz]

I'm pretty sure I tried turning it in both directions and I could hear the whir as it moved but the door still wouldn't open. I don't know whether it's staying locked or if it's the latch itself that jammed shut.

okay in that case it sounds jammed, I would persevere with the key a few times and pulling the handle whilst leaning on the door to take the load off the catch. must be slightly misalligned.