2016 180 Bi turbo CFCA engine failure is the EGR valve corrosion the cause of the scored and worn out bores
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- 180ps bi-tdi cfca engine egr
The first test showed 72ppm after 4,000 miles, second 42ppm after 2,000 miles, Millers suggested limit for increased wear metals is 30ppm for Alum. No other issues with the oil found other than this such as bearing material etc. Not sure of what ppm would be expected from healthy engine/oil, I sent Millers an email asking and waiting for response. Oil change due this week and will test again after 2,000 miles to determine next actions.
Appreciate the input
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Here's my reports for review
Last months
This weeks
Last months
This weeks
Your initial test with the 4000? oil miles isn’t helping with any accurate predictions as accurate running hours or in this case oil milage is important.
Regardless of that the contamination levels of Iron and Alum’ remain quite high.
Have you had a cylinder compression test?
Maybe worth using a cheap boroscope / iphone for a oil screen check via the sump plug port - never tried it on a T6.
It may also be possible to get a boroscope view of the cylinder bores via the sump plug port - again never tried it
An updated email just received from Millers which confirms some responses made earlier, thanks for those
Hi Steve
It is good to see that you have taken action with regards to the EGR and that you are performing the oil changed very frequently.
A normal Aluminium result for a healthy engine will typically be in low single figures, we alert customers when Aluminium exceeds 30 ppm. A VW CFCA with issues will generally exhibit 60 – 240 ppm. The abrasive Aluminium salt particles released from the corroding cooler causes bore wear leading to loss of compression and excessive oil consumption. If the EGR is replaced / blanked the ingress of the Aluminium salts is halted, I know from experience that we continue to measure elevated Aluminium levels for several oil changes even when oil flush products are used. I encourage short oil change intervals for this reason. (not to sell more oil!)
I wouldn’t expect any engine light for this issue, if the oil consumption is low, you have acted in time to save the engine and its likely to have a near normal lifespan.
Regards
Mike
Hi Steve
It is good to see that you have taken action with regards to the EGR and that you are performing the oil changed very frequently.
A normal Aluminium result for a healthy engine will typically be in low single figures, we alert customers when Aluminium exceeds 30 ppm. A VW CFCA with issues will generally exhibit 60 – 240 ppm. The abrasive Aluminium salt particles released from the corroding cooler causes bore wear leading to loss of compression and excessive oil consumption. If the EGR is replaced / blanked the ingress of the Aluminium salts is halted, I know from experience that we continue to measure elevated Aluminium levels for several oil changes even when oil flush products are used. I encourage short oil change intervals for this reason. (not to sell more oil!)
I wouldn’t expect any engine light for this issue, if the oil consumption is low, you have acted in time to save the engine and its likely to have a near normal lifespan.
Regards
Mike
Here is mine. 2014 Caravelle with 135k on it. Retro Resus said today DPF is completely blocked. So I woill get this done and then I am on 50/50 that the engine is trash. Its still on a n A cooler. Miller said the oil was much older than the last service, and RR said the gearbox wasn't serviced as described.
As far as I can see its worth going the whole way, even an engine etc as it is a great van and one owner from new in great shape, plus anything else I buy will have the same issues.
As far as I can see its worth going the whole way, even an engine etc as it is a great van and one owner from new in great shape, plus anything else I buy will have the same issues.
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Is this a CFCA engine?
One further matter to consider if you have the engine out is the turbocharger condition. The oil condition as reported is very poor and must have degraded the turbochargers. While it’s added expense an inspection and refurb’ will be cheaper than a subsequent total failure and replacement at a later stage.
So the engine in my 2013 T5.1 went kaput a few weeks after I bought it and the independent dealership I got it from footed the bill for an engine replacement which took about 6 weeks. They fitted a refurbished engine so fitted all the old ancilleries including my Suffix A EGR Cooler. I did advise them it was probably the EGR Cooler which killed the first engine so I'm quite skeptikal about the old cooler being fitted to a 'new' engine.
They don't want to budge on my precautions so my question is do I take it to another garage and get a new cooler fitted complete which will probably be around £1000 or do I get it blanked off (which is obviously the cheaper and quicker option)?
The only thing with blanking it off is that I don't know how it will affect MOT testing?
Many thanks
They don't want to budge on my precautions so my question is do I take it to another garage and get a new cooler fitted complete which will probably be around £1000 or do I get it blanked off (which is obviously the cheaper and quicker option)?
The only thing with blanking it off is that I don't know how it will affect MOT testing?
Many thanks
Cost wise blanking and tafmet is an easy diy job £100ish. Personally no issues with the mot. I don't believe most non main garages would find or be interested. Possibly vw main dealer might be more strict and look for the tafmet.
As I understand the issue was from the egr cooler and was an issue on the earlier Bi turbo models and a new improved Egr valve cooler was fitted from 2016 onwards,
I was never aware these engines were prone to total destruction from this problem until my kind garage warned me as mine is a 2016. I have checked the part No on my egr valve cooler and it has the later improved version but I still live in fear!!
The most obvious signs are smoke from exhaust and excessive oil consumption by which time it is probably to late.
I hope people here who have caught this issue early are able to avoid the worst,
The problem is evacuating all the old oil residue from within the engine, not sure if any high pressure flush is available
I was never aware these engines were prone to total destruction from this problem until my kind garage warned me as mine is a 2016. I have checked the part No on my egr valve cooler and it has the later improved version but I still live in fear!!
The most obvious signs are smoke from exhaust and excessive oil consumption by which time it is probably to late.
I hope people here who have caught this issue early are able to avoid the worst,
The problem is evacuating all the old oil residue from within the engine, not sure if any high pressure flush is available
My EGR has four reasonably thick blanking plates which means the original pipes won’t fit back on. It’s been spotted by two techs who have done oil changes that this will be spotted by an mot tester. So once I have a good oil test post blanking that there is a healthy reduction of aluminium in the oil I will look to modify the pipes and blanking plates so it looks OEM and not messed about with for the mot test later this year. Fingers are crossed. Don’t fancy the bill for a replacement EGR or worse still a new engine.
Mine has these too, I fitted the kit from Darkside Developments plus a Tafmet. I put an engine cover on so it's not that obvious.
I'm hoping it's not spotted by an MOT tester, but if it is, I guess I will need to do the same and put the original pipes back on with thin blanking plates.
So long as a different tech does the MOT compared to the service, hopefully one won't mention it to the other
I'm hoping it's not spotted by an MOT tester, but if it is, I guess I will need to do the same and put the original pipes back on with thin blanking plates.
So long as a different tech does the MOT compared to the service, hopefully one won't mention it to the other
I fitted just 2 blanks inlet and outlet of the egr. Pipes are in place so i guess may be less obvious than removing the pipes.
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