Swapping VSR for Cyrix-ct

[wbuchan]

After a lot of research and a steep learning curve here's my plan and some context.

Context: I bought a November 2015 registered T6 t28 Trendline Bluemotion converted to a camper in Jan 2017. It was fitted with Sargent EC155 and a VSR. The VSR is, I'm pretty confident acceptable ( it doesn't need a dc-dc) as the early T6s were built with T5 Euro 5 engines. It does have start stop and regenerative braking. But it doesn't have a smart alternator. Finding out about early T6s having T5 engines was particularly time consuming.

I've now fitted a 175W solar panel and a Victron mppt 75/15. Charging the leisure battery.

Question. I think I want to swap the original VSR for a Victron Cyrix-ct so that the solar charged leisure battery can also keep the starter battery charged. Particularly over winter when the engine is not being run a lot.

Currently I like this plan as I can swap the Cyrix-ct directly with the VSR without having to rewire or abandon existing components.

Thoughts

 

[Dellmassive]

not 100% sure . .

but i though that a smart alternator was part of the BLUEMOTION setup . . on both EU5 & EU6 engines.?

EU5/6 is the emissions related bits.

are have you tested your voltage on the van? . .

 

[wbuchan]

@Dellmassive - doubt has crept into my mind. I agree it is odd.

I've spoken to VW. They don't know, their records don't identify what sort of alternator is fitted to the van. I've checked with a couple of motor factors, their systems can't tell from the details available about the van.

The company that converted the van in 2017 claim it didn't need a dc-dc charger. (I reserve judgement on this claim)

Is there a way of checking whether there's a smart or regular alternator visually? The alternator is well hidden. Maybe there's something attached to the negative battery terminal of the starter battery?

Is there an alternative setup that would allow dc-dc charging and allow the solar/leisure battery to charge the starter battery?

any help very welcome.

 

[wbuchan]

okay - I think I might have sussed this out. I think the ribbed black plastic with red and yellow wires is the sensor for the smart alternator.

If that is correct then the SVR should never have been fitted back in 2017.
-

 

[Qnapper]

I fitted (removed from my old motorhome) a Sterling Battery Maintainer:
Battery Maintainer

Great bit of kit. Connected to my leisure battery, which has solar panel charging it and now never think about it. Vehical battery sits for weeks at 12.8volt 100% charged. Well worth the money, but there are other makes out there just as good.

 

[Dellmassive]

Lol.... I think you have just answered your own question.

Does your starter battery have a sensor on it...?

Looks like yours does.... So that means you have smart alternator.... Happy days.


And yes..... You should not have had a vsr or Citrix..


A DC-DC should have been fitted originally for best results.

 

[wbuchan]

For the time being I've decommissioned the VSR by removing the fuse between it and the starter battery.

Not long term, but ok, given I discovered the fuse has been blown for a while anyway.

Thanks for the help @Dellmassive

 

[Dellmassive]

The vsr is ok... And will work as a basic measure.

Don't forget VW themselves fit a SplitChargeRelay....

But a DC-DC is a way better option.

 

[DaveCrampton]

I have a 2017 Shuttle and can send a picture of the battery for you to compare against so you can see what my battery and sensor look like.

 

[wbuchan]

I have a 2017 Shuttle and can send a picture of the battery for you to compare against so you can see what my battery and sensor look like.

I'd appreciate that, thank you

 

[wbuchan]

The vsr is ok... And will work as a basic measure.

Don't forget VW themselves fit a SCR....

But a DC-DC is a way better option.

What does SCR mean please.

 

[DaveCrampton]

Sorry for the bad angle, the insulated case was in the way.

 

[DaveCrampton]

What does SCR mean please.

Silicon Controlled Rectifier

Silicon controlled rectifier - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Dellmassive]

What does SCR mean please.

SCR is acronym for.

Split,
Charge,
Relay.

(Just a basic relay that's Ignition controlled).

.....

The step up from that is a VSR.

That Voltage, Sensitive, Relay.

That's smarter and self controled and enables itself when the alternator rises the starter battery voltage above the leisure battery voltage......... Then shuts off when the when stops running.



.

 

[Dellmassive]

This is the sensor on the starter battery....

Fyi.... That neg terminal from the Victron charger quick connect should be connected to chassis.. not the NEG post of the battery.

(Like that the vans energy management system is not detecting the incoming charge from the EHU charger)




...

 

[Dellmassive]

Same here...

The BM2 unit is fine on the battery..(blue circle)

But what's the blue connector for?(red circle,)

..




...

 

[DaveCrampton]

This is the sensor on the starter battery....

Fyi.... That neg terminal from the Victron charger quick connect should be connected to chassis.. not the NEG post of the battery.

(Like that the vans energy management system is not detecting the incoming charge from the EHU charger)

View attachment 152219


...

View attachment 152220

Thanks for pointing this out, I'll move it onto the chassis.

 

[Dellmassive]

FWIW . . .


this is a T5 with NO SENSOR on the battery NEG post = Standard ALT / NON Bluemotion . .







+++++

this is a T6 with Battery/ IBS SENSOR on the battery NEG post = SMART ALT / With Bluemotion . .

 

[wbuchan]

Same here...

The BM2 unit is fine on the battery..(blue circle)

But what's the blue connector for?(red circle,)

..

View attachment 152228


...

Right now your guess is as good as mine. I'm fiddling about with the van today so I'll try and figure it out.

I'm on a steep electrical learning curve.

My current dilemma is, based on the fact that the 175W solar panel is awesome at providing power even on a dull day. The fridge is on permanently, powered by the sun.

- do I bother sorting a dc-dc charger out. It doesn't seem necessary
- do I bother having the solar/leisure trickle charge the starter battery, if it's only supposed to have around 80% charge to accommodate braking regeneration.

Having solar and an EHU seems to be all all I need.

Open to ideas…

 

[Qnapper]

If you are not driving the van, i.e.parked up, I would fit a battery maintainer as any access solar power not being used (wasted if fully charged leisure battery) will be used to keep vehicle battery topped up.
The longest time I have left your van was 6 months in the sun with one fitted and vehicle battery showed 12.8volts (that's with tracker, and alarm on 247) and started first time.