Victron Setup or something else?

[Scotty1974]

Evening all,

Completely new to converting a van, so just wanted to ask a few questions please.

I'm converting my T6 van and looking at the forums and online shops I'm leaning towards the victron setup.

The main thing I would like to have is the battery sited mid/end van, rather than under the driver seat as I might change the seats to Captain chairs in the near future and don't really want to have to change the electrical setup afterwards..

Currently looking at the following...

Victron Energy Orion Smart Non-Isolated DC-DC Charger 12/12-30A

Victron Energy Blue Smart IP22 12v Battery Charger 30 Amp

Battery Monitor BMV 700

Standard EHU

Not looking for Solar power at the moment (but can build it in) as we wouldn't be on a site for more than a day or so without driving for a couple of hours at least....

Power wise from the leisure battery while off grid..12v Fridge, TV, USB charging, lighting

No requirements for 240V unless on a campsite, so don't not looking to power an inverter whilst off grid.

So question would be

Is this a good setup?

What battery would be better (AGM or Lithium) and what capacity for a 24 period of not charging?

Is there anything else I need (apart from cable!!!)

Thanks for any advice in advance from a neewbie!!

Cheers

Scott

 

[Pete C]

That all makes sense, and is similar to what we have. You don’t say what sort of fridge you have though - hopefully a decent compressor type.

Personally, I would wire in a Victron solar charger as this will reduce disruption later.

A 100Ah AGM battery will be fine for 24 hrs off grid. Lithium will be more future proof.

You will need fuses and fuse holders for the higher current interconnects, and or course for the devices that draw power.

Pete

 

[roadtripper]

The main thing I would like to have is the battery sited mid/end van, rather than under the driver seat as I might change the seats to Captain chairs in the near future and don't really want to have to change the electrical setup afterwards..

Are you changing from a double seat?

Either way the driver's seat base should stay the same, and it's a lot shorter run of the high current cabling.

If the budget allows I'd go LiFePo if you're going to all the effort.

If you are going to regularly drive consider if you need EHU at all. You could always add a quick connect to the starter battery and use one of the waterproof Victron chargers to support the batteries for longer stays (assuming the Victron Orion can do voltage triggered charging)

 

[Scotty1974]

Hi Pete,

Thanks for your reply. Fridge wise I'm looking at the CRX50 or similar, and forgot to add that I will be installing a diesel heater (probably underslung) and a pump for the water!!!

Crazy things you forget!! Yes was thinking of adding the solar charger (again victron) so that we could add the solar at a later stage without having to rewire at a later stage.

Would you suggest a higher Ah AGM based on that or is that a good capacity, I did look at the 170Ah versions and though that would be a good bet?

Thanks again

Scott

 

[Salty Spuds]

Personally I would definitely go lithium ca.100Ah. I’d also consider downsizing the Victron mains charger to the 15A version. If you’re going to be on EHU for more than a couple of hours, 15A will be plenty, it will cover all your domestic 12V loads & keep the battery topped up. Most importantly, the 15A is fanless I.e. silent. IMHO 30A is overkill. We have the 15A/Lithium battery setup & do some serious off grid camping & it’s all fine.
Also, again in IMHO, solar is essential from the get go. In the big scheme of things it peanuts.

 

[Scotty1974]

Hi Road Tripper,

Thanks for your reply. I'd like to make this as fool proof as possible.

ECU will unfortunately be needed as the love of my life will need a hairdryer and at some point on our journeys!!

Front seats at the moment are a double swivel and the drivers seat, but would like to change this to 2 captain chairs in the near future..

Cheers

Scott

 

[Pete C]

Hi Pete,

Thanks for your reply. Fridge wise I'm looking at the CRX50 or similar, and forgot to add that I will be installing a diesel heater (probably underslung) and a pump for the water!!!

Crazy things you forget!! Yes was thinking of adding the solar charger (again victron) so that we could add the solar at a later stage without having to rewire at a later stage.

Would you suggest a higher Ah AGM based on that or is that a good capacity, I did look at the 170Ah versions and though that would be a good bet?

Thanks again

Scott

100 Ah is sufficient based on my experience, but if you can afford and fit the higher capacity, then do so.
If you go as high as 170 Ah AGM, then I would probably go Lithium.

The point about the mains charger is a good one - 10A is plenty in my experience (for a 100Ah battery).

Pete

 

[Scotty1974]

Hi Salty,

Thanks for your reply.

So if we go for a 15Ah Victron charger from the EHU, would you suggest the same for the B2B charger. We would probably be driving each day for a couple of hours (if non campsite...ie lay overs) I can add a solar charger no problem at all to the setup

My concern really is placing the battery mid frame in the van, or if it would be an issue moving this all to the back of the van instead of it being under the seat

Cheers

Scott

 

[Scotty1974]

Hi Pete,

So if I go for a lithium, then I take it I can place it mid/end van just a matter of cable size?

I suppose the EHU would be nearer, just worried that the B2B would need to be nearer to the engines alternator

Cheers

Scott

 

[Salty Spuds]

Hi Salty,

Thanks for your reply.

So if we go for a 15Ah Victron charger from the EHU, would you suggest the same for the B2B charger. We would probably be driving each day for a couple of hours (if non campsite...ie lay overs) I can add a solar charger no problem at all to the setup

My concern really is placing the battery mid frame in the van, or if it would be an issue moving this all to the back of the van instead of it being under the seat

Cheers

Scott

I’d keep the 30A B2B & go 15A on the mains charger. Think about it:- you drive for a couple of hours, so you need the battery to charge asap. Lithium will charge much faster than lead acid ( of any flavour), so you arrive at the campsite with a fully charged battery, or close as. You then plug in your EHU & the 15A mains charger takes over. Chances are you’ll be parked up for at least overnight, if not longer. So the mains charger will have plenty of time to do its thing. You’re going to be parked up for much longer than you’ll be driving, so you don’t need as much mains oomph as B2B oomph.

 

[Salty Spuds]

Hi Pete,

So if I go for a lithium, then I take it I can place it mid/end van just a matter of cable size?

I suppose the EHU would be nearer, just worried that the B2B would need to be nearer to the engines alternator

Cheers

Scott

You can put what you want wherever you like as long as you size the cables correctly.

 

[Scotty1974]

Hi Salty,

So go for a 30Ah B2B and a 15Ah mains Charger, makes sense...

So would a 100Ah Lipo be better than a 170Ah AGM then for what I'm trying to acheive? I know the cost would be more but would rather get it right from the start

Also would the cabling be ok to move the battery to the back/mid than being nearer to the bonnet!

Cheers

Scott

 

[Scotty1974]

....and big question, if I go for the Lipo, what would be the best brand to get?

 

[Scotty1974]

Thanks Salty, didn't see your replay about the cable size

 

[Salty Spuds]

....and big question, if I go for the Lipo, what would be the best brand to get?

It’s a rapidly changing market & tbh I’m not au-fait with what’s hot & what’s not at the moment. I have a Super-B epsilon and it’s been faultless but was pricey 4 years ago. It’s now been replaced with a 150Ah in the same package size. If I was buying again, I’d buy another Super-B.

Epsilon 12V150Ah - 12V Lithium Iron Phosphate Battery 150Ah

The Epsilon 12V150Ah is an intelligent 12V Lithium Iron Phosphate battery (LiFePO4) with a rated capacity of 150Ah

www.super-b.com

 

[roadtripper]

So would a 100Ah Lipo be better than a 170Ah AGM then for what I'm trying to acheive? I know the cost would be more but would rather get it right from the start

Make sure if you go Lithium it's a LiFePo - more expensive but the cells are more inherently safe and have a significant increase in charge cycle lifespan.

A rough rule of thumb is you get the same usable capacity out of a LiFePo battery as twice the size of Lead Acid.

Also the LiFePo, if looked after by good chargers, will generally last a good deal longer.

So when comparing prices comparing the two capacities you quote between reasonable brands is about comparable. Prices in the 100ah LiFePo region are dropping.

My point about the seat bases is if you are only placing the battery elsewhere just because you may want to change the double seat be sure that's what you want. You can certainly cable to where you like, the California has a rear battery and many other conversions do, but you will need heavier duty and longer cabling and you will lose space. If you can get the 12v kit in under the driver's seat base and the EHU consumer unit under the bonnet by the battery you have more space in the van. It might be a challenge with the Victron kit you want but worth considering, or worth considering changing the seat first?

 

[Scotty1974]

Evening All,

Apologies for not replying, been a long day!!!!

I've been looking at my project this evening, and I would still like to go for a mid-end body battery setup, only reason being that even if I don't go for the captain seat setup I would be looking at having an underslung diesel heater under the drivers seat.

I've just had a quick look at the super 8 and they are around £800, but renology are having a sale at present...100ah LiFePo around £400 and also Fogstar and Eco-worthy around the same

Has anyone had experience of these batteries, if so are they a good alternative to the higher priced ones?

Will have a look at the EHU being positioned under the bonnet over the weekend and see if I can go with that..

So questions again!!!

What would the cable size need to be if I went with a mid frame battery.....EHU at back 15amp Victron....B2B 30 amp victron at the front....would it be 35mm2 for both or could I get away 16mm2 on the EHU?

Thanks again

 

[Salty Spuds]

Evening All,

Apologies for not replying, been a long day!!!!

I've been looking at my project this evening, and I would still like to go for a mid-end body battery setup, only reason being that even if I don't go for the captain seat setup I would be looking at having an underslung diesel heater under the drivers seat.

I've just had a quick look at the super 8 and they are around £800, but renology are having a sale at present...100ah LiFePo around £400 and also Fogstar and Eco-worthy around the same

Has anyone had experience of these batteries, if so are they a good alternative to the higher priced ones?

Will have a look at the EHU being positioned under the bonnet over the weekend and see if I can go with that..

So questions again!!!

What would the cable size need to be if I went with a mid frame battery.....EHU at back 15amp Victron....B2B 30 amp victron at the front....would it be 35mm2 for both or could I get away 16mm2 on the EHU?

Thanks again

You will be limited on cable size by the terminals on the respective devices. If you look on 12v planet’s website, they have a very helpful cable size calculator. You will need to tailor your installation within the limits of the terminal sizes of your chosen devices.
Is there a particular reason you’re hankering for a double front seat? Is it a seat numbers issue (kids?) or is it just something you think you might need? The double front seat isn’t the most comfortable seat & if you’re in the middle it’s horrible tbh. Twin captain seats are waaay more comfy.

Voltage Drop Calculator | 12 Volt Planet

Use our Voltage Drop Calculator to select the correct Cable for your campervan, motorhome or boat wiring application. Auto and Marine Electrical Components from 12 Volt Planet - Cable Size Calculator

www.12voltplanet.co.uk

 

[roadtripper]

Also look in the instructions for the Victron DC-DC charger, it should list cable and fuse sizes for various run lengths that are compatible with it's terminals.

Be aware Eco Worthy seem to have quite a big sale on today and tomorrow:

Various Discounts Go Here:

https://www.regtransfers.co.uk/search/platedetails/vw1?utm_source=google&utm_medium=dynamicremarketing&utm_campaign=personalisedgroup1&source=dyrem&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI07nenufHgQMVBc3eCh1A1Q1rEAEYASACEgK26PD_BwE This popped up on line today - 25%off and 4 months easypay :oops: A snip at...

www.t6forum.com

 

[Scotty1974]

Thanks both for your replies,

Salty, I would rather have the 2 captain seats, but stupidly purchased the Kiravans swivel for the double....agreed if anything it's made it more uncomfortable as I'm 6.4 lol.....and no the kids can bugger off and buy their own van, this is for me and the wife...maybe to odd grandchild when we feel like it!!!

I might ask kiravans if they will take the swivel back as they have a 90 day return and it hasn't been used (just installed), other than that will just sell it on eBay!

I was looking at captain seat to buy the singles from, do you know if they are any good or is there better out there?

Roadtripper, yes was looking at the Eco Worthy site earlier...seem to be cheap, Renology are also doing some bumper deals on their site and also bundles with the control panels...Do you know if either are any good.

Will have a look at the run lengths this weekend, had a quick look at vunked and 12 volt planet and they quoted 35mm2 and 16mm2 on the setup i wanted (just didn't have option for a mid-end frame) I'm used to dealing with 240V ring mains....this is a bit new to me, will get there in the end though!!

Thanks again