4motion - worth the extra cost?

[RT76]

I’ve had my ‘velle for a number of years, 2017 with 55k on it. Love it, except for the ongoing battle with the suspension (I have to remind myself that it is a commercial vehicle underneath!)

However, I always wanted a 4motion and had to compromise when I bought this one.

Now, I find myself in the fortunate position of having a friend with a track car that I can borrow, and he is looking at getting a trailer for it to reduce ongoing running costs (it’s road legal at the moment).

A 4motion would obviously add some stability/traction when towing, but are there any other benefits or drawbacks to making the change.

I expect that a switch is likely to cost me in the region of £6-7k, which is a big outlay!

 

[DaveD]

I’ve had my ‘velle for a number of years, 2017 with 55k on it. Love it, except for the ongoing battle with the suspension (I have to remind myself that it is a commercial vehicle underneath!)

However, I always wanted a 4motion and had to compromise when I bought this one.

Now, I find myself in the fortunate position of having a friend with a track car that I can borrow, and he is looking at getting a trailer for it to reduce ongoing running costs (it’s road legal at the moment).

A 4motion would obviously add some stability/traction when towing, but are there any other benefits or drawbacks to making the change.

I expect that a switch is likely to cost me in the region of £6-7k, which is a big outlay!

I bought a 4 Motion because I use my van on fields and woods quite often, as well as towing a 2 tonne trailer, but there are drawbacks.
It adds a significant amount of weight to the van, reducing the amount you can carry and it knocks a bit off your fuel consumption.
Lots of people tow similar weights with a front wheel drive van with no problems, so it's certainly not essential.

 

[TallPaul_S]

Worse fuel economy
Higher road tax
Less choice of vehicles
More complex engine and drivetrain - potential for bigger bills

Unless you regularly drive off-road then I don't think it's really needed. If you've not got towbar on yours, get that sorted and see how it is. Tbh it could take you 6 months to find a Caravelle 4motion!

 

[FerrisBFW]

I tried a few non-4motion of same spec Caravelle's and then this 4motion. I really like the way this one drives. Fuel consumption seems pretty good. I have driven it in muddy fields a few times, even on the original tyres, and it was great. We drove to Les2alps at NY and on very icy and snow covered roads again it was excellent (now on winter tyres).

Biggest issue with 4 motion Caravelle's I would say the fact they are all BiTDI engines I think (in the UK)

 

[RT76]

I am struggling to see the upside for the money, I have to be honest.

Other than being less likely to be stuck in bad weather, it seems more of a flex than a benefit and a tow bar would be cheaper, although there are other elements such as lights, acc that I would like that may make the switch more palatable.

Who knows!

 

[Sim60]

We regularly go to events where we park in fields, forest tracks etc.
When we were thinking of buying our first van ( early 2020) , we were parked in a grass field with a whole array of campers. 20 mins before people started departing, the heavens opened and the ground was saturated in minutes.
We saw one T6 just sitting there with its front wheels spinning. 2 vehicles away another T6 just drove off without any issues - it was a 4motion and that sold it to us. Didn’t get to see close up what tyres were involved, but neither were all terrain.

Simon

 

[RT76]

We regularly go to events where we park in fields, forest tracks etc.
When we were thinking of buying our first van ( early 2020) , we were parked in a grass field with a whole array of campers. 20 mins before people started departing, the heavens opened and the ground was saturated in minutes.
We saw one T6 just sitting there with its front wheels spinning. 2 vehicles away another T6 just drove off without any issues - it was a 4motion and that sold it to us. Didn’t get to see close up what tyres were involved, but neither were all terrain.

Simon

I’ve heard of those kind of events…

 

[buggycpl]

We are currently still looking for our first T6, the original plan was to go for a 4motion as we will be using it for towing the beach buggy on a trailer to shows/events, sometimes for work plumbing and gardening, and we are in a fairly rural area. Not that we drive across muddy fields all the time but the thought was quite nice that we could if/when we did.
In fact, we have decided to go for a non 4motion due to the weight saving, the more plentiful supply of second hand vehicles available and the numerous posts and reports that the 2.5 tonne towing capacity of say, a 150 T32, eats up the towing of diggers, cars, large trailers etc. We may end up stuck in a field one day cursing our decision, but on the plus side, that would give us an excuse to go shopping again for a 4motion! Half the fun is upgrading, modfying and learning - every cloud!

 

[drinfinity]

We have a 4Motion to get off fields at cyclocross and enduro racing. It’s definitely more capable there than my previous FWD, and with all season tyres, and inspired confidence on the road up to Haweswater in winter conditions.

For tarmac only FWD would be fine, but I’m happy with our 4Mo.

 

[RobertO2023]

As always there are pros and cons with 4wd but towing a heavy trailer or caravan 4wd wins most of the time. Fuel economy is pretty awful when towing. Overall a more expensive vehicle to own and run albeit with added flexibility.

 

[buggycpl]

We have a 4Motion to get off fields at cyclocross and enduro racing. It’s definitely more capable there than my previous FWD, and with all season tyres, and inspired confidence on the road up to Haweswater in winter conditions.

For tarmac only FWD would be fine, but I’m happy with our 4Mo.

Perfect video to show the difference between a capable van in the conditions getting out of the field, and sitting and waiting a couple of hours for a tow!

Horses for courses.

 

[RT76]

Like everything, it seems to always come down to the ££.

In terms of the drive I imagine there’s not much difference - am I right in that the 4motion is driven by a Haldex (damn you auto correct… ) and so drive to the rear is only engaged when there is slippage to the front wheels? If so, then other than the extra weight and a bit of drag from the weight of the prop/driveshafts to the rear, there’s not too much difference in normal circumstances.

I can swallow the cost of fuel, I drive maybe 8k a year in mine, so not likely to be overly noticeable.

Tax, I’ve found one in the same bracket as the one I have, so again not too concerned by those costs.

There are a few options that mine is missing that I could take the opportunity to add into the spec too if I’m prepared to wait, and cost wise I think it would all be on a par with making the changes to this one.

Ultimately, I think I will always wish it was 4motion (partly as the last family wagon was a Landrover).

Decisions, decisions.

Thanks for your comments and vids, it is a big help.

 

[RT76]

We have a 4Motion to get off fields at cyclocross and enduro racing. It’s definitely more capable there than my previous FWD, and with all season tyres, and inspired confidence on the road up to Haweswater in winter conditions.

For tarmac only FWD would be fine, but I’m happy with our 4Mo.

Diff locks or no?

 

[DaveD]

am I right in that the 4motion is driven by a Valdez and so drive to the rear is only engaged when there is slippage to the front wheels?

It's a Haldex unit, I think it's the fifth generation of Haldex, it's pretty sophisticated stuff and will detect wheelspin and engage the rear drive before the driver knows it's happening.
Rear diff lock is an optional extra, although they're even harder to find on the second hand market.

 

[TallPaul_S]

Would you be staying with a Caravelle?

If so just remember how rare they are in 4motion form. Out of 40 T6/6.1 Caravelles on AT, 3 are 4motion. One is an SE which personally isn't the right spec for a Caravelle. One is 100k miles at 4 years old so not the best (and a private seller) and the last one is up for £63,600 Inc VAT.

Be prepared to 1. Wait a long time if you want a 4motion Caravelle and 2. Travel to anywhere in the UK when one comes up.

 

[drinfinity]

Diff locks or no?

Diff lock on, and ASC off in the video.

 

[Johnod17]

It’s a yes from me !

 

[Chris Sherwood]

If you think you will be going off road (wet grass), then yes. If not, no need for it.

 

[TallPaul_S]

I do wonder just how much of a difference a set of decent all terrain tyres on a 2wd van makes.

Maybe at the next boggy meetup we need to do some 'scientific' testing

4motion with std summer tyres Vs 2wd with Bridgestone KO2's!

 

[WinFreak]

I do wonder just how much of a difference a set of decent all terrain tyres on a 2wd van makes.

Maybe at the next boggy meetup we need to do some 'scientific' testing

4motion with std summer tyres Vs 2wd with Bridgestone KO2's!

I think the tyres will make more of a difference

I've driven my rwd bmw m3 on winter tyres with no problems through the snow while people with 4wd's on summer tyres were stuck in the carpark at work!