Dreaded AdBlue issues - any advice before VW inspection

[Parvus]

Hi all,

My van (2018 T6, 53k miles) is booked with VW Van Centre on Friday morning for the initial inspection relating to my AdBlue and Engine Mgt Light (EML). I've searched the forum and reading lots of similar experiences so trying to gain as much knowledge and advice before Friday 5th booking.

The background/timeline and current issues:

• A couple of months ago I experienced an intermittent EML which soon become permanent. I suspected DPF clean so booked into local garage.
• A few days before the scheduled work the routine AdBlue low message appeared and added the usual 10L (been doing this successfully for 5-6yrs), but the warning message remained. I've read the similar experiences in the forums but could not resolve the problem.
• The van arrived at the garage with TWO faults 1) EML was on 2) AdBlue error and 400 miles before the van would not start
• Fault diagnosed as an EGR Valve, paid £1800 to replace EGR, Cooler and Pipe. Garage unable to find the root cause of AdBlue, suspected overfilling so drained and half-filled. All lights out, van appears okay.
• Approx. 6 weeks later AdBlue low warning and I tentatively added 2-4 litres, checking dash in the process, eventually added nearly 10L, warning remained. Now 650 miles countdown until the van cannot be started.
• Not at the same time as the AdBlue warning, the EML came back. So I'm back to the same TWO problems having already invested in the EGR replacement.
• I visited the the local garage who was happy to check the EML and errors codes. Code suggesting a faulty AdBlue injector. Agreed to replace if needed.
• Garage identified the existing AdBlue injector was working okay, clean and not blocked. Explained they recommend visit VW for diagnosis to prevent continually replacement parts.
• Van is now booked with VW Van Centre for Friday 5th - £100 charge for inspection before any work.

Carly Error Codes:
P20EE00 - SCR Nox Catalyst below threshold (bank 1)
P040100 - Exhaust gas recirc. Flow insufficient detected

I'm now dreading where this could go, and the expense of main dealer diagnosis and replacements. I have the above codes visible from a Carley, so looking for any help or ideas. Overall a great van and well maintained, but having a nightmare trying to solve the emissions fault/problems.

Has anyone experienced and similar journey and might have some recommendations - all welcome

Thanks,
Matt

 

[Hilly64]

I will watch this thread with interest. had similar issues for approx 2 years and still no fix

some wise sages I have spoken to have suggested I might never get to a fix however I have a warranty package so in a slightly different place to you. This also leads me to the conclusion that unlike yourself VW seem reluctant to replace parts but tbf they cannot replace a component unles they can demonstrate a part has a fault or they are directed otherwise by head office ..... so far after many visits to the main dealership they have found nothing but the fight continues

My fault only lights up on a longish drive particularly sitting at around 2000 RPM on cruise so doing a 24 mile road test is never going to highlight an issue

 

[Parvus]

I will watch this thread with interest. had similar issues for approx 2 years and still no fix

some wise sages I have spoken to have suggested I might never get to a fix however I have a warranty package so in a slightly different place to you. This also leads me to the conclusion that unlike yourself VW seem reluctant to replace parts but tbf they cannot replace a component unles they can demonstrate a part has a fault or they are directed otherwise by head office ..... so far after many visits to the main dealership they have found nothing but the fight continues

My fault only lights up on a longish drive particularly sitting at around 2000 RPM on cruise so doing a 24 mile road test is never going to highlight an issue

Am really shocked to hear you're living with the fault when the van is in warranty. Have you tried different VW Van centres? I know from experience with other brands, it often comes down to the culture in the dealership and franchise. Might be worth exploring.

Will keep things updated here and hopefully the final resolution to help others.

 

[Parvus]

Update on my van following VW Van Centre. Inspection confirmed they run the ‘test procedure’ and requires new AdBlue tank. Authorised the work and costs £1600 (ouch).

Collecting the van today, will see if this fixes my EML issue and hopefully some trouble free motoring.

 

[Bamboo Green]

Update on my van following VW Van Centre. Inspection confirmed they run the ‘test procedure’ and requires new AdBlue tank. Authorised the work and costs £1600 (ouch).

Collecting the van today, will see if this fixes my EML issue and hopefully some trouble free motoring.

Just picked up on this feed. Mine is giving me problems too. Started with EML which was diagnosed as a nox sensor. Had that replaced at an independent, as my local VW centres has changed hands and hasn't filled me with confidence since especially everytime I did go in there was a change of staff every time....anyway it ran for a day with 3000miles before adblue then...650miles and flashing spanner icon and adblue light on. Everything has been gone through time and time again. The faults have been checked and have been clear, so they thought it was a generation 1 system so it would reset itself after a couple of hundred miles as theyve had similar faults on other vehicles with adblue. I'm now down to 250 miles until "no start". My dash did show 1-1.5 gal until full. So as a last ditched attempt put 5 litres of adblue in, now its not registering how many gals until empty. I was assuming as that reading seemed to coincide with how much adblue is in the tank, so assuming the ultrasonic is ok but have wondered if the pump is actually working properly.

So long story short, have you had any luck having the tank replaced. As I understand it that has the ultrasonic level indicator, the pump and the heater built in. Do you know if its worked or is it too early for you to tell? Hoping it has for you!

 

[davross]

Hi, did anyone manage to get this sorted? Booked in with Van center (2 weeks wait). Have read that could be a software update fix, but this thread suggests hardware as well. I'm getting the P20EE00 - SCR NOx Catalyst Efficiency Threshold error but no EML. Also Adblue top-ups not registering and down to severe range limit 150miles. Syphoned out 2 liters, didn't reset range driving for a couple of weeks. Had van 2 years 1st 10litre Adblue working fine, 2nd 10litre problems began. Any info gratefully received. Thanks

 

[Hilly64]

Also interested in any outcome. I am on my >10 visits. Keep getting twirled by dealership. They say they keep doing test plans and fix as advised by VW tech but no fix. Definition of madness - doing the same thing and expecting a different outcome

Asked about EGR cooler or replacing adblue pump/tank but seem reluctant to even go there due, in my mind being under warranty. It’s exhausting and warranty running down. Plus cost me for courtesy van and loss of my time

I am now considering going down legal route but what do i want other than the van fixed which they seem incapable of doing

VW customer care are absolutely useless!!

 

[davross]

Also interested in any outcome. I am on my >10 visits. Keep getting twirled by dealership. They say they keep doing test plans and fix as advised by VW tech but no fix. Definition of madness - doing the same thing and expecting a different outcome

Asked about EGR cooler or replacing adblue pump/tank but seem reluctant to even go there due, in my mind being under warranty. It’s exhausting and warranty running down. Plus cost me for courtesy van and loss of my time

I am now considering going down legal route but what do i want other than the van fixed which they seem incapable of doing

VW customer care are absolutely useless!!

Yeah I'm hoping to avoid that vortex and expense. Seems like Pentagon who run my local VW Van Center don't have the best reputation and being out or warranty does not sound like a good place.

Out of interest have you yourself been given the software update or is it not available for you?

I'm a 2017 T6 150 on factory software version.

Tia

 

[ben5560]

Also interested in any outcome. I am on my >10 visits. Keep getting twirled by dealership. They say they keep doing test plans and fix as advised by VW tech but no fix. Definition of madness - doing the same thing and expecting a different outcome

Asked about EGR cooler or replacing adblue pump/tank but seem reluctant to even go there due, in my mind being under warranty. It’s exhausting and warranty running down. Plus cost me for courtesy van and loss of my time

I am now considering going down legal route but what do i want other than the van fixed which they seem incapable of doing

VW customer care are absolutely useless!!

Have you tried complaining directly to VW UK?

 

[Bamboo Green]

Hi, did anyone manage to get this sorted? Booked in with Van center (2 weeks wait). Have read that could be a software update fix, but this thread suggests hardware as well. I'm getting the P20EE00 - SCR NOx Catalyst Efficiency Threshold error but no EML. Also Adblue top-ups not registering and down to severe range limit 150miles. Syphoned out 2 liters, didn't reset range driving for a couple of weeks. Had van 2 years 1st 10litre Adblue working fine, 2nd 10litre problems began. Any info gratefully received. Thanks

Hi @davross, I have literally had my bus back week now. I got down to 90 or 95miles before I handed it over to Carrs VW at Indian Queens Cornwall. Tbh they had it 6 weeks. Mine was showing no faults on their test equipment but visually they could clearly see it wasn't working and was not resetting. I did put a load of info up somewhere on the threads. But basically, I've had a new tank, new glow plug 3, new genuine vw nox sensor.
Mine all actually started by showing a nox sensor fault which was changed for an aftermarket compatible sensor, at another garage we use. Thats when the countdown problems started. Then my tank had started doing strange readings during the countdown on the the dashboard, so maybe it was part of the problem too. It was when the nox sensor was changed for a genuine part that everything sprung back into life and reset was achievable. I will say, mine is running absolutely lovely. Its like how it was when I first bought it 8 years ago. Does regular regens and seems that the readout from the tank to my dash display seems a lot more accurate than I've ever known. Price was around £3300. Cannot remember exactly how much as had other works done as routine maintenence prior too, which was about another £1200 elsewhere, and that did inc the other nox sensor. Which tbh I shouldn't have bothered with. I should've gone genuine straight away unless a guaranteed fix. However my bus seems to be on a bit of a changeover of software and parts where some aftermarket parts will work and some wont. Hope its of some help

 

[davross]

Hi @davross, I have literally had my bus back week now. I got down to 90 or 95miles before I handed it over to Carrs VW at Indian Queens Cornwall. Tbh they had it 6 weeks. Mine was showing no faults on their test equipment but visually they could clearly see it wasn't working and was not resetting. I did put a load of info up somewhere on the threads. But basically, I've had a new tank, new glow plug 3, new genuine vw nox sensor.
Mine all actually started by showing a nox sensor fault which was changed for an aftermarket compatible sensor, at another garage we use. Thats when the countdown problems started. Then my tank had started doing strange readings during the countdown on the the dashboard, so maybe it was part of the problem too. It was when the nox sensor was changed for a genuine part that everything sprung back into life and reset was achievable. I will say, mine is running absolutely lovely. Its like how it was when I first bought it 8 years ago. Does regular regens and seems that the readout from the tank to my dash display seems a lot more accurate than I've ever known. Price was around £3300. Cannot remember exactly how much as had other works done as routine maintenence prior too, which was about another £1200 elsewhere, and that did inc the other nox sensor. Which tbh I shouldn't have bothered with. I should've gone genuine straight away unless a guaranteed fix. However my bus seems to be on a bit of a changeover of software and parts where some aftermarket parts will work and some wont. Hope its of some help

Thanks for your reply buddy and sharing your journey. I'm fairly sure, although hard to be certain, that I had the 'PE20EE00 - SCR NOx Catalyst Efficiency below threshold' running ODBEleven scans way before any MFD ad-blue (DEF) level issue. I just didn't understand it thus didn't think its was a problem! I never got an EML for it though, not sure if previous owner had disabled the EML for it or even if thats possible. Odd that you didn't get any error code or EML. There seems to be many variations of this issue, I guess thats why its so hard to pinpoint a diagnosis. I'm not happy to payout to the levels that you have to fix something that just 'should work' so i think if a simple sofware update does not fix it for me then I will have to go down the adblue delete route and just pray that no new MOT adblue mapping checks are introduced in the future such as with the DPF delete checks. Not what I want to do but only affordable solution.

 

[Bamboo Green]

Thanks for your reply buddy and sharing your journey. I'm fairly sure, although hard to be certain, that I had the 'PE20EE00 - SCR NOx Catalyst Efficiency below threshold' running ODBEleven scans way before any MFD ad-blue (DEF) level issue. I just didn't understand it thus didn't think its was a problem! I never got an EML for it though, not sure if previous owner had disabled the EML for it or even if thats possible. Odd that you didn't get any error code or EML. There seems to be many variations of this issue, I guess thats why its so hard to pinpoint a diagnosis. I'm not happy to payout to the levels that you have to fix something that just 'should work' so i think if a simple sofware update does not fix it for me then I will have to go down the adblue delete route and just pray that no new MOT adblue mapping checks are introduced in the future such as with the DPF delete checks. Not what I want to do but only affordable solution.

I can fully appreciate it too. I was so so close to deleting it out, but I just wanted 1 more try.
A reputable company who are well known, they quoted me £250 to delete it out, providing I signed a waiver. I was exactly the same though, it should be a case of, this is the fault, this is the fault code, this will fix it, rather than...this "might" fix it, or if not, this might fix it, etc etc. I've heard a number of other people have had it deleted on other VWs and other brands of cars. So not an uncommon problem, although VW Germany were of no help to my local VW dealer when they requested help and information regarding my bus. Tbh without either the fix or deleted it was a land anchor and not worth anything. I'll see how I feel summertime and perhaps sell her as thinking of a change anyway. VWs offer was a lowball tbf. Thought around double (ish) what they offered. Considering the costs and recent spend on her I'd rather either keep it myself or let someone own it knowing theve got a great bus.

Re if something had been hidden on your bus' obd II reader. We've just had the same on our sons car. Its come up with two little glitches, but my reader would only read 2 ECUs. We had one item looked at by a local indie and now more glitches have shown themselves. However, I can now also read 16 ECUs so you may be on to something with that.

Also, with the fault on mine, the eml didnt always illuminate either. So sometimes I thought everything was fine, get in the following day and it'd come on!! I hope either route you take you get it sorted. Maybe if you go to a really well known company, they may be able to give you a definate answer as to whether its a software update or something different. Not sure where you are but a place in Bristol had good reviews VW related and adblue but I ran out of miles to take it anywhere in the end. I was open to the idea of getting it deleted until I could get it somewhere who could fix it other than a VW centre. But I'd been going round in circles for 5months by this time and couldn't do any more! Got my fingers crossed for you

 

[Hilly64]

Yeah I'm hoping to avoid that vortex and expense. Seems like Pentagon who run my local VW Van Center don't have the best reputation and being out or warranty does not sound like a good place.

Out of interest have you yourself been given the software update or is it not available for you?

I'm a 2017 T6 150 on factory software version.

Tia

I have had more software updates than an Iphone

 

[Bamboo Green]

I have had more software updates than an Iphone

Sorry only just seen this looking for a post on removing the front wheel inner plastic liner. Got to swap an idler pulley!! They didnt say they'd done an update but things do seem to be working better including my start stop that stopped about 6 years ago!! I had a long ol list of things done on a text thing they sent me to allow works to be done. So I'm going with probably, however I think they tried it first and it didnt work for mine. That doesn't mean it won't work for yours. There's plenty of people out there that have had it done and its worked. Fingers thats all you need!

 

[Tinbasher]

Hi, did anyone manage to get this sorted? Booked in with Van center (2 weeks wait). Have read that could be a software update fix, but this thread suggests hardware as well. I'm getting the P20EE00 - SCR NOx Catalyst Efficiency Threshold error but no EML. Also Adblue top-ups not registering and down to severe range limit 150miles. Syphoned out 2 liters, didn't reset range driving for a couple of weeks. Had van 2 years 1st 10litre Adblue working fine, 2nd 10litre problems began. Any info gratefully received. Thanks

Hi Guys, 2 nd transporter I’ve had since 2009 2.5 T5 sport line flying machine, o probs at all. Upgraded to 2017 150bh highline adblue model with quite a few niggly errors that can live with, except adblue top up warning. Have done this several times without issue up to 85k ish. Put in 10 litres at 600m warning expecting light to go off as before - no no no - it stops on & triggers other warnings !! Decided to buy my own vag diagnosis plug in machine, as deffo do not trust “fob off experts” at dealers & wildgoose chase costing time & dosh: no further ahead yet ! I’m a skilled engineer of practical common sense fixes: look, seek, fix, no probs. Electronic gobbledegook is another world altogether - no logic whatsoever !!! I know I look after my van & love it: knowing all is ok mechanically, & determined to separate the “IT” dead ends that cause unnecessary grief “ I’ve read here” also, & cut out the untrustworthy middle man, wanting to sell me a new van: before its sell by date. Hoping to keep you posted guys, as me & my T6, joined at the hip

 

[davross]

Hi Guys, 2 nd transporter I’ve had since 2009 2.5 T5 sport line flying machine, o probs at all. Upgraded to 2017 150bh highline adblue model with quite a few niggly errors that can live with, except adblue top up warning. Have done this several times without issue up to 85k ish. Put in 10 litres at 600m warning expecting light to go off as before - no no no - it stops on & triggers other warnings !! Decided to buy my own vag diagnosis plug in machine, as deffo do not trust “fob off experts” at dealers & wildgoose chase costing time & dosh: no further ahead yet ! I’m a skilled engineer of practical common sense fixes: look, seek, fix, no probs. Electronic gobbledegook is another world altogether - no logic whatsoever !!! I know I look after my van & love it: knowing all is ok mechanically, & determined to separate the “IT” dead ends that cause unnecessary grief “ I’ve read here” also, & cut out the untrustworthy middle man, wanting to sell me a new van: before its sell by date. Hoping to keep you posted guys, as me & my T6, joined at the hip

I'm same situation as you owned a 2.5 AXD for 10 years - no problems apart from usual maintenance repairs. Upgraded to the 2017 150 euro6 1 3/4 years ago. First year all good topped up Adblue fine range updated 6000 miles. 6 months ago whilst sat on drive ignition on AdBlue DEF range went from 1200 miles upto 4500 miles. Wasn't even moving. Anyway ignored and 3 months later range dropped from 3500 to 650 miles. Got down to 450 and topped up recommended amount range didn't change. My local mech syphoned out 2 liters, drove for another week. No change. Took it to a Pendle specialist yesterday he upgraded OEM software and he ran a regen on DPF wanted to explore the possibility of Adblue delete. He advised against due to potential DPF clogging down the line / MOT problems etc. Long story short still have the error DEF range 150. Hoping it just clears n the next day or 2 after the software update and couple of bottles of anticyrstal additive. Booked into VW commercial on Tuesday so will see what they recommend. No engine error codes in ODBELEVEN. Leaning towards Adblue delete rather than having an unusable paper weight.